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  • #46
    **** it man, where were you a week or so ago?

    You are correct, this pole originally had a gas lamp on top, later retrofitted with an electric light and the gamewell upgrade, which was the light flasher mechanism. I have the mechanism for this box. I also have the mechanism for the gamewell box that goes to this pole. I also have the doors. There were attached with brass bolts.

    The base is in good shape. I have the original mounting bolts too, or what's left of them after they cut them off the mount. Then it's for those bolts are square.

    I was planning to just stand this sucker back up and put stainless steel set screws in it, I don't want rust streaks running down my new paint job!

    That's cool you have all that history bottled up to share. There are two more of these left. One is exactly like this one, the other has some scroll work done around the edges on the pole and the foundry name is much smaller and in a different place. I don't know which one is older, but they were made by the same foundry here in Beaumont.

    Thanks for sharing!

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    • #47
      Well Franz, I found your reply enlightening, informative and with reference to Carbon Arc Brazing, a reminder that it was 1972/3 that I last used it as a welding process to join metal. High school shop class, and my introduction to welding.
      Where did the time go? I sure hope I'm not the only one with a twin head torch in their basement ? Probably, but I hope not? This one did actually get used once hooked to a Dynasty, notice the new terminal ends. No, I didn't use pencils when I tried. A soft and some what sloppy flame.

      You mentioned replacing the tungsten with a carbon electrode. I have to ponder that for a few reasons? Finding collets and bodies greater then 1/8" comes to mind as a supply issue to be addressed, although I'm understanding they can be found up to 1/4", as does smaller diameter carbon electrodes, I don't think I've ever seen a 1/8" carbon arc rod? The other question is electron flow and conductor surface? I'm kind of curious in a way that say's I might have to try this out? I'm tempted to strip the wood off a pencil and give it a try in my torch to see what happens? Lol...added to the list.

      And because you mentioned Boston...we'd stopped for a break just out side of and as luck would have it, attracted the locals? They were friendly. I'm telling you, warm fuzzy memories.





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      • #48
        Originally posted by ryanjones2150 View Post
        **** it man, where were you a week or so ago?

        You are correct, this pole originally had a gas lamp on top, later retrofitted with an electric light and the gamewell upgrade, which was the light flasher mechanism. I have the mechanism for this box. I also have the mechanism for the gamewell box that goes to this pole. I also have the doors. There were attached with brass bolts.
        The doors should have a hole in them that locates near the crossbar of the base casting for the original "lock" that was a threaded hook indexing the crossbar (similar mechanism to a spare tire carrier). The brass screws are a retrofit. Somebody in signals had their fill of the #$%^&* lock.

        If you want to go first class build a retro gas lamp housing from some angle & strap and put an electric light inside it. The newer cool white LED from sylvania comes close to light output.

        If your consideration is just standing it up, glue some used flat rubber belting on the bottom, stick a garbage bag inside and pour a couple hundred pounds of Sackrete inside the base. You can always chop the concrete out with a .401 gun if you need to and it will prevent tipping. They DO tip.


        The base is in good shape. I have the original mounting bolts too, or what's left of them after they cut them off the mount. Then it's for those bolts are square.

        I was planning to just stand this sucker back up and put stainless steel set screws in it, I don't want rust streaks running down my new paint job!
        PLEASE Don't. Stainless in contact with cast WILL grow rust. You live near salt water it will grow faster. Stainless + cast becomes a battery similar to the Beirut battery.


        That's cool you have all that history bottled up to share. There are two more of these left. One is exactly like this one, the other has some scroll work done around the edges on the pole and the foundry name is much smaller and in a different place. I don't know which one is older, but they were made by the same foundry here in Beaumont.

        Thanks for sharing!
        That base/post was very popular around the turn of the Century for a multitude of applications. The first traffic control lights used the same type post sitting on a large concrete island in the middle of the intersection.
        There is a lot of information on signals and boxes on the internet, and much of it is wrong.

        Bear in mind in 1901 telephone pretty much didn't exist so pretty much all communication between Fire Headquarters and houses was by telegraph. Firemen weren't notorious for their skill as telegraphers so signals were kept short & simple.
        If you can hunt up detail on how your city loops were set up you'll be able to gain a much better idea of what the box cards were used for and how they were used. In the world before Motorola Second and third alarms were sent by retripping the box, which explains the 4 round capability of the clockwork, so additional companies could respond.

        It's a very simple system that developed into a system that filled the need.

        See if you can find an old goat with leather lungs who can tell you the origin of Hook in a Hook & Ladder company and how that was used before iron engines replaced horses. He can also explain running boards and might be able to tell you about ham handed telegraphy.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Noel View Post
          Well Franz, I found your reply enlightening, informative and with reference to Carbon Arc Brazing, a reminder that it was 1972/3 that I last used it as a welding process to join metal. High school shop class, and my introduction to welding.
          Where did the time go? I sure hope I'm not the only one with a twin head torch in their basement ? Probably, but I hope not? This one did actually get used once hooked to a Dynasty, notice the new terminal ends. No, I didn't use pencils when I tried. A soft and some what sloppy flame.

          You mentioned replacing the tungsten with a carbon electrode. I have to ponder that for a few reasons? Finding collets and bodies greater then 1/8" comes to mind as a supply issue to be addressed, although I'm understanding they can be found up to 1/4", as does smaller diameter carbon electrodes, I don't think I've ever seen a 1/8" carbon arc rod? The other question is electron flow and conductor surface? I'm kind of curious in a way that say's I might have to try this out? I'm tempted to strip the wood off a pencil and give it a try in my torch to see what happens? Lol...added to the list.

          And because you mentioned Boston...we'd stopped for a break just out side of and as luck would have it, attracted the locals? They were friendly. I'm telling you, warm fuzzy memories.




          WRONG Carbon process! Your thinking is understandable because very little Carbon welding has been done since TIG machines arrived in shops around 1970.

          If you go to the link I posted you'll see a single carbon being employed in a manner very similar to tungsten in a TIG torch. Carbon used in that manner was the original electric welding process before uncoated rod came along. The process still works very well if you take the time to learn it.
          Carbon rod is still available down to 1/16 but that diameter is very fragile. Smallest I have is 3/32 and it works well.

          The "ice tong" you posted is best used on an AC machine for loosening tight and or rusty nuts, particularly wheel nuts. With the machine off, locate 1 carbon on each side of the nut tightly so no arc develops, and switch the machine on. The nut will get hot, usually hotter than the stud, and the AC will add vibration that destroys the rust in the threads. Lincoln included this information coming with new machines in the 1960s.

          DON'T even think about pencil carbon. That material is a mix of graphite and wax along with some clay to harden the "lead" and it will light off.

          My tong hangs on the wall waiting for its next chance at a tight nut.

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          • #50
            What you won't find hanging on some guys wall, lol. I bet it's an interesting wall! And I've seen interesting walls...some say I have interesting walls? Pencil lead I heard graphite and clay, not sure about wax? But...in generalizing, hard lead, lots of graphite? I'm going to try. No guts no glory? If it will carry a current I'll find out. Hard way works. How fast could the tip melt right?

            I'm adding on the list as well a carbon in an electrode holder. See what we can do? Hooked to the Syncrowave I'll be fun. Captured and renewed an interest, yes you did.

            Honestly, when you mentioned using a carbon arc process I mostly choked. Then I laughed. I thought Franz, you...what...that's good. Land before GTAW.
            I was still growing pubes in 1970. Twin carbon or single carbon, who looked back and said I've used one of those, left alone and still do?
            But yea, like anything, you play, learn the tricks, it's how they rolled.

            I call that the magic. Seeing what happens when the current changes direction or the cables leads are reversed. I see it.
            Seriously, that's lost art stuff and what's gets me, I see an advantage using it. Tendency with GTAW is over heating the base material, too focused an arc. But saying it out loud...sounds crazy.

            I'm trying to balance the knowing it works part, with the modern technology part, and find myself thinking, time, place and practice. That said, you have me thinking, add it to the list.

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            • #51
              Probably ought to mention, Use a water cooled TIG torch or a stinger when you get to playing/learning.

              Keep your arc short too.

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              • #52
                So the guy from the city facility maintenance checked with his buddy in engineering about what will be required for a good base for this thing. We were planning something substantial and plumb it for power at some point soon, but the city engineer guy came back with a pole base 16" in diameter drilled to 6' below grade. The bottom of this pole is about 22"-ish inches in diameter, so we'd have to build it a little at the top, but goodness, 6'!?

                We were talking about getting an 8' sonotube about 24-ish inches in diameter and cutting it in half. I sent back a request for going wider instead of deeper, but I haven't heard back.

                Of course I could be way off and this engineer fella is right on, but goodness, that seems a little excessive to me.

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                • #53
                  Help me out here; What city?
                  Is it a filled area? How much fill?

                  Is the engineer's name Dilbert?

                  The game is to lower the center of gravity of the supported device 6" below ground level. We had thousands of precast solid concrete streetlight poles 18 feet above ground with 100 pounds of harp and fixture on top that were plugged into the ground 3 feet. So you want to add a little for hurricanes, say 6 more inches to be safe. Usual Fire Service MASS make better We lift iron, add an inch to the top.

                  A 30 foot wood utility pole in sand is only 5½ in the ground.

                  Did the "Engineer" formerly work for a NY Hospital and have blonde hair? Is she enamored by firemen?

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                  • #54
                    Ha! That's what I figured. There's really no telling where this got his numbers. City of Beaumont engineering. You should see how they backfill street crossings for water and sewer, it's freakin sad.

                    So we were closer by just guessing about taking an 8' sonotube and cutting it in half. After leaving enough sticking out to mount the pole on, there would be 3 to 3 1/3' in the ground. Probably closer to 3. Also probably a little much, but if this thing gets blown over in the next hurricane I'm going to pretty irritated.

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                    • #55
                      Quick and dirty says red clay.

                      Sounds like a perfect training opportunity for academy kids to practice digging a 4 foot deep 24" diameter hole while you fab up the above ground form which should be 6" thick and get the 12" long anchor bolts taped up and ready in the template. You'll also want to prep your stakes for the form and check the vibrator.

                      If you hit sand, line the hole with an overgrown garbage bag to prevent dewatering the concrete in the hole,

                      Have you got any gas stations being remodeled or rebuilt in the area? The concrete island curbs can often be had free when they're being removed. If you get really lucky a decent backhoe operator can pull the whole curbed island and foundation that supported the air dispenser and drop it in your hole.

                      Alternate plan F: safe dealers will generally donate money chest type safes that they hauled in post burglary attempt. Those weigh about 2200 pounds and you can weld anchor bolts to the face plate.

                      DON'T FORGET THE CONDUIT FOR THE WIRING.

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                      • #56
                        I already got the conduit, had some 2" laying around, so that's what I'll use. I already made the plywood templates to hold the anchor bolts too. We have an academy class starting pretty soon, but I don't think they'll start in time, so the probies on shift already will get a shovel or three full. If I can get the streets or water department to loan us a backhoe or mini-ex, I can run that. I ran heavy equipment before I became a fireman. That was a pretty good job too. Paid more.

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                        • #57
                          This is the other pole, not the one I repaired, and one of the pull station boxes.
                          Attached Files

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                          • #58
                            I think you underexposed the pictures cause they are just giant white squares here.

                            Any chance you can post some pics of the innards of both the pullbox and the ****able lightswitch box Gamewell insisted on producing even though there are acres of empty inside the box.

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                            • #59
                              I tried again, third attempt, let's see if it works this time.

                              I know we took the guys to the museum, let me see if anyone else got a picture of them. No telling when I make it down there next time.

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                              • #60
                                Ryan,

                                What type and size tungsten did you use for the repairs?
                                Miller Dynasty 350, Dynasty 210 DX, Hypertherm 1000, Thermal Arc GTSW400, Airco Heliwelder II, oxy-fuel setup, metal cutting bandsaw, air compressor, drill press, large first aid kit, etc.

                                Call me the "Clouseau" of welding !

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