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Tig welding 4130 tubes, neeb question

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  • kakarot
    replied
    I got magnets on fire, and made good amount of holes.

    How do I know overheating?
    and ye, I forget to clean stuff before I weld.

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  • M1.30-'06
    replied
    You're welds appear to be overheated and contaminated. Make sure to clean the material of all mill scale and dirt/residue before welding. In a few of the pictures, your tungsten looks to be sticking out way too far causing you to lose gas coverage. The bead is inconsistent and lumpy.. you really need to practice laying down a consistent bead without overheating before welding the real deal. Practice, Practice, Practice

    I noticed you're using magnets near one of the welds also. I dont know if you experienced this, but in my experiences this will cause an erratic arc and it makes it very hard to even get a decent tack weld, much less a full bead.

    I see some gaps in the fitup of the tubing also. This will cause you a lot of headaches especially when welding .035" wall tubing. It makes it hard to get a decent bead, and it makes it very easy to blow a large hole. Try and keep your tubing fitup very tight.

    Im not bagging on you, just some constructive criticism. You gotta start somewhere and weve all been there before. Good luck with your project.

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  • kakarot
    replied
    couple more:

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  • kakarot
    replied
    some more pics, my friend took them:



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  • Aerometalworker
    replied
    Yep Practice Practice Practice. And while your at it invest in a long sleeve welding jacket. Skin cancer and/or burns isnt fun. Also post weld anneal if its critical.

    -Aaron

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  • kakarot
    replied
    been welding the thing up, me and my friends tacked it all together, and now we are welding it all up. we used 1/2 a tank on tacking and practicing welding. I am a master hole wizard. I think I made most holes, and I have filler most holes. Using er70S2 is pretty easy, I tried a bit stronger material and it became harder to weld because it did not flow as easily.

    Anyways, basically non of us know how to weld right, so we are trying our best. Its very easy to make a hole in 4130 1x0.035 tubing even with 1/16 tungsten and welder set to 75amps top.

    After we finish the welding, I take some good pics. For now just some spoilers:

    Me welding:


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  • Aerometalworker
    replied
    Originally posted by gary gonzales View Post
    hello all,
    preheating or annealing as some call it,it not required on 4130 tubing
    you would have to get the tubing a 1550 degrees,and hold it a that temp
    from anywhere to 30min to 24hrs ,depending on the thickness,and as far
    as what cup to use i use a no.8 for all my tubing,and if you want it to look
    really slick,,,use a gas lense cup

    Gary,
    Preheating is different then a post weld anneal. And yes you need the post weld anneal to do a proper job. Im not going to go into the details of it here but the short version is the untempered Martensite due to the rapid gas quench when tig or mig welding the thin material. Simply warming the joint up to a dull red, and slowly letting it cool takes the Martensite through its critical temperature range without it becoming un-tempered. You wont find this on think sections but its very common on tubing. There have been many reported failures of Tig and Mig welds on 4130 due to this exact cause. What you described is commonly called normalizing, and is different then a full anneal. We in the aircraft industry have had to learn the hard way about this material, its easy to work with, welds beautifully, but must be treated right.
    Have fun!

    -Aaron

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  • gary gonzales
    replied
    welding 4130 tubing

    hello all,
    preheating or annealing as some call it,it not required on 4130 tubing
    you would have to get the tubing a 1550 degrees,and hold it a that temp
    from anywhere to 30min to 24hrs ,depending on the thickness,and as far
    as what cup to use i use a no.8 for all my tubing,and if you want it to look
    really slick,,,use a gas lense cup

    Leave a comment:


  • fun4now
    replied
    cool, looking forward to the pic's.

    Leave a comment:


  • kakarot
    replied
    Got 300cf of argon, ordered er70s2 welding rods, will pick up on wed.

    Soon some pics........

    Leave a comment:


  • kakarot
    replied
    Thank you all for responses, will go to the store tomorrow, today closed.

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  • phila.renewal
    replied
    Whatever it's worth, I've read that ER70S-2 is recommended for welding 4130.

    Save the -6 for mild steel.

    Good luck with it.

    Leave a comment:


  • kakarot
    replied
    Awesome, thnx for tips, I will run then 20 to 25cfh.
    I go try to buy the gas tank today, getting a biggest one, getting 244cf of argon. at about 25 cfh it should give about 10hrs of work, is that true or it uses a lot more. Will try to get the filler rods if the store has them, otherwise I order online. The accessory kit that came with the welder had yellow/gold tungsten. ether a thoriated at 1% and radioactive or lathaneded at 1.5%. I might just buy some premium tungsten. I also have a gray one, and a red one but they are 1/8.

    I might get the gas lens, To waste less gas if its a non expensive thing. If its over 30 buks, then probably I wont get it.

    I will also get couple of tig gloves, a welder sleves, my friend wants a mask, umm thats preaty much it then. Oh and the part where the tungsteen goes back into the handle, it got broken, so I need it so I wont waste any tungsteen.

    I am kinda on a budget.

    As soon as I will do anything I will post some pics. maybe couple of practice welds, and frame is starting to build up.

    Leave a comment:


  • fun4now
    replied
    although they may look at your electic welder kinda funny and hand you a real torch.

    LOL. thats funny, but probly true.
    good luck, some first hand help would be a good idea.

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  • Aerometalworker
    replied
    Ahhhh Formula SAE, I know it well.
    To prevent fatigue cracks in your welds, anneal them with a torch after welding. Also dont be tricked into "tiny weld" syndrome, keep large nice looking welds. Watch the part cooling rate on thin sections.
    Tig works OK on 4130 providing you post weld anneal.
    If you want some hands on help go to your local aircraft mechanic that works on antiques. They will be more help then any manual for technique, although they may look at your electic welder kinda funny and hand you a real torch.

    -Aaron

    Leave a comment:

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