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  • #16
    Originally posted by Engloid


    Of course the companies think they can get the same work out of two $10/hr kids than they can from an experienced guy at $20/hr.... The sad part is that most of these companies are managed by people that are so ignorant that they never even know what they've got after it's gone. They are too stupid to be able to track labor hours and productivity.

    In other words, they see the money it costs for a $50 tool, so they try and save it. However, they aren't smart enough to figure out how much money they're losing by not having it. They do the same thing with their workers.
    Same thing where I work. We are now having an early out. In the Springfield area only one guy will have more than 5 yrs experience. No problem just send a guy to training. Ha as Cary says. Right now a couple of people that took the last early out are back at work as contractors. I know it's a dog eat dog world but it seems managerment is really out of touch. I guess it's a result of the computer spreadsheat and the virtual office.
    Dennis


    Thermal Arc 185-TSW
    Millermatic Challenger 172
    VictorO/A
    Atlas Craftsman 12 by 24 Lathe
    Esab PCM-875
    Wholesale Tool Mill-Drill

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    • #17
      Gotta laugh at the typo in my last post. Managerment Sounds like a Bushism! Too bad that books been done or I might have made a buck. Not to worry I bought a lottery ticket.
      Dennis


      Thermal Arc 185-TSW
      Millermatic Challenger 172
      VictorO/A
      Atlas Craftsman 12 by 24 Lathe
      Esab PCM-875
      Wholesale Tool Mill-Drill

      Comment


      • #18
        A very good friend of Mine is a production welder for a VERY large ag, construction, and consumer lawn/garden equipment manufacturing company.... His plant makes Only construction and logging equip. They've hired many new welders in the last 2-3 years..... Wages are no more than competitive, benefits are not as good as the older workers and there's no company pension anymore. I was Really surprised the UAW approved a contract like that, but He says the caliber of worker filling these new postions is very poor.
        Denny
        MillerMatic 185
        HyperTherm 600
        Dynasty 200 DX
        Will-Weld 200A Buzzbox
        O/A torch

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        • #19
          I have a few friends that are into the race car fab shops doing proto type race cars for GM, He makes around 17.00 hr. However He's very good.
          Over the years alot of my friends wanted the cool factor and have worked for Roush Racing doing tig work for 11.00 -13.00 hr. Granted they were not on the race team.
          They all have left to get real jobs that enabled them to actually buy a house.
          I have a couple of my friends that have regular jobs and build race cars on the side for extra money.
          When they tell me how much they make on the cars it is unbelievable, I make 4 times the money working on old dump trucks than they do on the race cars, however I dont get to have the cool factor.
          Kind of like buying a nice old Hot Rod, It costs $ 35,000.00 to restore one or you can buy one already done for $ 25,000.00 Mind you I'm using this as an example but I'm not to far off.

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          • #20
            actually ive made a pretty good living building race cars for the last 20 yrs but i paid my employees crap as most of the time they couldnt produce. Ive had days where ive made 2 k and an average 8 hour day just working myself ill make about 700.00 but you have to know what your doing i would say its at least 10 yrs in the game before you can make that kind of dough . would i choose it again sure but i would rather do it down south maybe in mid west or florida as there is a huge market down there . I'm kinda bored with it at moment but cant turn away good paying jobs and im booked for next six months now i pick and choose my work. basically you will be a grunt for at least 5 yrs then start your own business . Im sure there are better trades this is for the love of what you do though that is for sure. My motto is dont cut your prices just choose your work as there are alot of ppl with dough that will pay for good work main thing is to not cut corners as one bad job can ruin your Rep.
            Miller aerowave full feature
            Lincoln power mig 300 with prince gun
            dynasty 200 dx
            lincoln sp 135 plus
            302 trailblazer
            s22p12
            powcon starcut
            cp 400 metal spray

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            • #21
              There is a wide range of pay depending on what series of NASCAR you are in. The Craftsman Trucks pay lees that the Cup series team. You can expect between 25K-55K to start depending on experience. I know people that start well above that but they have other Cup fab experience. Once you get experience, the pay goes up pretty good. The catch is, it's such a small market and everyone knows everyone so if you excel at your fabrication, you go far...the down side of that is if you are just average, you are stuck at the lower paying jobs.

              What school are you looking at??

              Andy

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              • #22
                dont let the starting pay turn you away from this trade, its just when compared to other welding and fabing fields the pay is offset by the cool factor. If you can afford to live at a certain pay level and love your job thats great, then you can build up your name and do well.I learned to weld so I could do motorsports related work,but the better money came from construction, and theres nothing cool about welding nuts on broken bolts under a 963 track loader in the mud, except the check with my name on it.

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                • #23
                  Rich,

                  The only place you have a chance at making a decent living is in the nascar business.

                  The chances of getting on a good team out of a school is extremely slim.

                  I would plan on relocating. I moved to north carolina to go racing. i started with a small busch team for $200 a week. It is soooooo competitive that i could not find a decent job. so, i moved out of state to take a job with a craftsman truck team. that's the easiest way to get one of these jobs. however, you really still need experience (more than a school) to get in a shop. we've hired a couple of students, and most don't last long. it's possible that you'll have to volunteer for a team after school. it's that competitive.

                  everybody knows everybody. you want to get into a shop and do good work. you must know people to get into the good shops. the longer that you're in the business, the more people you'll know, and the better your chances are of getting in a good shop. i'm hoping that next year i will be back in north carolina with a good team.

                  good luck.
                  dave.

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                  • #24
                    Thanks for the replies everyone !


                    The main reason I was asking about pay is because I live in the Bay Area in Ca. which is probably the most expensive place in the US. I just wanted to get an idea of pay to see if I could survive on the pay > I dont expect to be a millionaire . I've just been debating weather or not to follow a dream or just get back into my union (sheet metal) and make good money. I guess I should go for the money cuz then I'll have enough to have a "dream" hobby instead of a dream job.


                    Rich

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                    • #25
                      Rich, after building drag race cars and street rods in my home garage for 0 2 many years, I opened My dream shop. It took off like gang busters and I soon found myself back logged to extreme lengthy promise dates for new prospective customers. Like dandimand said I started picking My work. I had 4 full time fabricators, 2 part time, myself and My Wife. Iam telling You this because I also had about 5 or more job applicants per week! I didn't have the time to check out all of them so My decisions about which applicant to further investigate His background and to spend time interviewing had to be made rather swiftly. Un fortunately, probably lots of great talent slipped by but that was the best I could do. I don't know about Nascar shops but I would imagine with the popularity of their sport they must do things close to the same way. If You are young as I suspect and hope to raise a family some day, I would encourage You to follow other avenues. Possibly building cars in Your garage and developing a reputation that way while staying with Your current career. Good Luck. Carl

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                      • #26
                        thanks again for the advice ! But now I need alittle bit more !

                        For those of you who are garage builders/fabricators how or where did you learn to bend tubing ? Or better yet where can I learn (books, videos, websites etc.) ?

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                        • #27
                          mittler bros has a good tube bending cd . I learned by making many mistakes and just kept pluggin away at it . though the first five years i went to school and also worked as a millwright as the first five years i wouldnt have made enough to eat at taco bell and live in a cardboard box if i didnt work somewhere else.
                          Miller aerowave full feature
                          Lincoln power mig 300 with prince gun
                          dynasty 200 dx
                          lincoln sp 135 plus
                          302 trailblazer
                          s22p12
                          powcon starcut
                          cp 400 metal spray

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I was self taught, trial & error with help from this group when I hit a wall and some other internet groups.

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                            • #29
                              There are a lot of companys that sell chassis kits with the bends already done for you.
                              I would start with that and after you learn how to build a chassis the proper way then you can get into tube bending and bending your own stuff.
                              I have built a couple of cars for friends and thats the way we did it.
                              Don't know much about the roundy round stuff but Mark Williams, Chassis shop, Chris Alston, S & W and Art Morrison all sell kits to build a chassis for drag racing. I know Speedway Motors sells chassis parts for the guys that turn left.
                              http://www.speedwaymotors.com/

                              Hope this helps
                              Bob Kraemer
                              PS: What the others said about trial & error process of learning is 100% true
                              Bob Kraemer/Licensed Electrical Contractor

                              Miller 330 ABP
                              Tree Mill W/DRO
                              South Bend Lathe
                              Tennsmith Brake
                              Tennsmith Shear
                              Beverly Throatless Shear
                              JD/2 Bead roller
                              O/A Torch
                              Drill Press
                              Grinders, Belt Sander Etc!
                              And more hand tools than I know what to do with

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                              • #30
                                Contact the NHRA (providing You plan to build drag race cars), purchase the SFI specs., for the type of cars You plan to build, this will arm You with the min. specs and some idea how to build them. Go to national events and look at the cars that are built by the big time builders, this also will stimulate some ideas.
                                Buy some tubing, practice, even if You are making headboards, lol. Make shop equipment. You will soon learn scrap is only scrap if You allow it to be. Make something useful from all Your mistakes.
                                Don't forget, no matter how long You are bending tubing You will still make the ocassional mistake. Good Luck. Carl

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