Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Homemade Tig cooler question

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Homemade Tig cooler question

    I have my adjustable output Procon pump and a 1/6 hp bodine motor and my 6" fan is on the way from Surplus, I need to figure out what kind of a radiator to use. I have been trying to decide if I chould get a small transmission cooler (less money) or a heater core (more money)? Anyone have any ideas out there I would like to put a telltale on it but maybe I should just get the one from Miller that they use on the coolmate 3. Then all I need is some sheetmetal and some purple paint
    Regards, George

    Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
    Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
    Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

    Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
    Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

  • #2
    I was considering using one of the radiators normally used for computer water cooling. Specifically one of the Black Ice dual 120mm fan radiators made by hardware labs, or a similar model. I was thinking about mounting it behind my D200DX so when the "fan on demand" kicked on it would cool the torch too. Where did you get the pump? Ebay?

    Comment


    • #3
      I think your best bet is to cool the water at all times. Now some of these pumps put out higher PSI than you'd find in say a water cooled PC and I have a lot of experience in that arena as well. So if using those parts you need to make sure they'll handle the pressure and won't restrict the flow. Personally - I plan to build a water cooler and use a transmission oil cooler for the radiator. Any solid, copper tube heat exchanger that can handle the pressure would be ideal - and my hunt for one is not over yet. Heater cores are by far the most flexible solution and also cheap so with the right fittings soldered on it would probably work just fine as well. I'm going to buy a Coolmate or Binzel 3 and then proto-type a cooler that will use a standard 110V 120MM fan, carbonator pump motor and a Procon pump. Typically in some of the other coolers like a Bernard, the motor has a shaft exiting the motor on both ends. You hook the pump to one side and the fan to the other. To me that limits your flexibility in component placement - which is why I'd approach it with a motor and a seperate fan. I already have a brand new Procon pump with what looks to be an adjuster on it for pressure.

      My Diamondback 20 250amp torch kit showed up today and I don't have a cooler... AHHH.. I need to get something and soon.
      David W.
      Machines: Millermatic Passport; Millermatic 350P, Dynasty 300DX TIGRunner, TD Cutmaster 51 Plasma, Hypertherm 190C Plasma,
      Machinery and Project Pictures: Click Here

      Comment


      • #4
        funny, i'm not alone! Got my weldtec 20f-25r yesterday! beutiful! so much smaller than the aircooled db 17. I too have a procon pump and motor, i'm using a used B&M tranny cooler and a 110volt 6" fan i found at my friends shop. I am concerned about regulating the pressure though. i think my unit has a pressure adjustment but it isn't a bypass style. Meaning it just restricts the flow causing the pump to essentially dead end. i wan't one that will bypass excess flow back to the tank.

        I picked up fittings to adapt it to my garden hose until my cooler is built. I have the tank that came with the carbonator but i think i will make my own to keep it as small as possible.

        Does anybody know where to get stainless steel fittings i can weld into the tank for the water cooler lines. i don't know the name of the style of fitting the water and gas lines use. i think i will probably go with stainless tubing and an tube nuts inside but i need something to connect the torch to.

        Sundown:

        the tranny coolers are nice and strong, i particularly like the B&M coolers, but thats the only thing B&M sells i like. Pic is attached
        Attached Files
        Dynasty 200 DX
        Millermatic 175
        Spectrum 375
        All kinds of Smith OA gear

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Prototype3a
          I was considering using one of the radiators normally used for computer water cooling. Specifically one of the Black Ice dual 120mm fan radiators made by hardware labs, or a similar model. I was thinking about mounting it behind my D200DX so when the "fan on demand" kicked on it would cool the torch too. Where did you get the pump? Ebay?
          Yes, on Ebay for $32.00 if it was used it is really hard to see.
          Regards, George

          Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
          Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
          Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

          Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
          Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Laiky
            <snip> i think my unit has a pressure adjustment but it isn't a bypass style. Meaning it just restricts the flow causing the pump to essentially dead end. i wan't one that will bypass excess flow back to the tank.<snip>
            I havn't seen any procon pumps that bypass the flow, I think that if you can get it set to about 100 psi it should work fine.
            Regards, George

            Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
            Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
            Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

            Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
            Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by unixadm
              I think your best bet is to cool the water at all times. Now some of these pumps put out higher PSI than you'd find in say a water cooled PC and I have a lot of experience in that arena as well. So if using those parts you need to make sure they'll handle the pressure and won't restrict the flow. Personally - I plan to build a water cooler and use a transmission oil cooler for the radiator. Any solid, copper tube heat exchanger that can handle the pressure would be ideal - and my hunt for one is not over yet. Heater cores are by far the most flexible solution and also cheap so with the right fittings soldered on it would probably work just fine as well. I'm going to buy a Coolmate or Binzel 3 and then proto-type a cooler that will use a standard 110V 120MM fan, carbonator pump motor and a Procon pump. Typically in some of the other coolers like a Bernard, the motor has a shaft exiting the motor on both ends. You hook the pump to one side and the fan to the other. To me that limits your flexibility in component placement - which is why I'd approach it with a motor and a seperate fan. I already have a brand new Procon pump with what looks to be an adjuster on it for pressure.

              My Diamondback 20 250amp torch kit showed up today and I don't have a cooler... AHHH.. I need to get something and soon.
              I like the idea of a seperate fan also. If your pump has a acorn looking nut on the inlet side with a flat head screw in it, thats the adjuster.
              Regards, George

              Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
              Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
              Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

              Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
              Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

              Comment


              • #8
                You can make your own pressure bleed regulator easy enough. T off the outlet from the pump and put a small ball valve in there. Rather than restricting the flow to the torch, you'll bleed off the excess back to the tank. Getting the right size valve might take some trial and error, and then getting it set right will be part of that process.

                I actually used a ball valve to bleed off air pressure running my aux ports on a 13B rotary after eliminating the vacuum contraption they had that ran them from the factory. I kept the air pump, but all it did was open the aux ports. I'd adjust the valve so that it would only build enough pressure at the right rpm. Worked really slick.
                Syncrowave 250DX
                Invison 354MP
                XR Control and 30A

                Airco MED20 feeder
                Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 81
                Smith O/A rig
                And more machinery than you can shake a 7018 rod at

                Comment


                • #9
                  i like the ballvave idea, but i'm going to try and find a regulator. I guess once you set it it doesn't really change though.

                  Sundown:

                  The specs i've seen for the 20 series call for 50-60 psi and 1-1 1/2 quarts per min of flow. I think 100psi might do some damage.

                  i was playing with the idea of an electronic flow and pressure gauge. As a way to know that you have water flowing, maybe just a light activated by a pressure switch. It would be nice to have an interlock of some kind with the footpedal so you can't blow up the torch.

                  i have also seen the wc torch fuse blocks but i don't know how to incorporate it with the dynasty style connector.

                  if i sound like i'm making this more complicated than it has to be, i'm just excited about a chance to build something, its a good exercise.
                  Dynasty 200 DX
                  Millermatic 175
                  Spectrum 375
                  All kinds of Smith OA gear

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Laiky
                    i like the ballvave idea, but i'm going to try and find a regulator. I guess once you set it it doesn't really change though.

                    Sundown:

                    The specs i've seen for the 20 series call for 50-60 psi and 1-1 1/2 quarts per min of flow. I think 100psi might do some damage.

                    i was playing with the idea of an electronic flow and pressure gauge. As a way to know that you have water flowing, maybe just a light activated by a pressure switch. It would be nice to have an interlock of some kind with the footpedal so you can't blow up the torch.

                    i have also seen the wc torch fuse blocks but i don't know how to incorporate it with the dynasty style connector.

                    if i sound like i'm making this more complicated than it has to be, i'm just excited about a chance to build something, its a good exercise.
                    I got the 100 psi number from the remanufactured procon pump that they sell for these coolers, turns out that number is the max output and they are set for 50 psi output. Since the adjustable restrictor is on the input side (on my pump anyway) I don't see any problem with cranking it down so it only has enough water to put out 50 psi, just need to get a pressure guage and set it while its running. I have a pressure guage from an old 300# sand filter for a pool that reads from 0-100 psi, I was thinking I might be able to adapt that and just leave it on as a visual aid. I think that all that would need to be done would be to tee it off just past the output side of the pump. Does that sound right, I am new to this kind of stuff but like you say it is fun to learn while building.

                    Added: I am not clear on one thing, why does it matter if you bleed off water or just restrict the input flow to the pump flow if you have 50 psi at the outlet side of the pump and are flowing about 1.25 qt/min?
                    Regards, George

                    Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
                    Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
                    Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

                    Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
                    Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      George,

                      It depends on the pump design. Genarally, cetifugal pumps can tolerate a restricted output to some extent unless it is enough of a restriction to produce cavitation. In any case, it increases motor load.

                      Positive displacemnt pumps, like vane, gear, and piston types, tolerate restriction in output flows poorly. They will actually either blow a hose/fitting/pipe or stall comlepetly if the output is totally blocked without some sort of relief valve.

                      It should be relatively simple to rig a relief valve that will dump back into the tank. I'm not at all familiar with the pump youhave, but if an output restriction can damage it, you need to allow the overpressure a place to go.

                      Hank
                      ...from the Gadget Garage
                      Millermatic 210 w/3035, BWE
                      Handler 210 w/DP3035
                      TA185TSW
                      Victor O/A "J" series, SuperRange

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Attached is a drawing of the setup, the acorn nut on the right side of the pump is to adjust the pressure with, there is a valve and a spring inside on a shaft with a screw that be turned to adjust the inflow. According to the guy who sold it to me the range of adjustment is 50-150 psi. I don't want to restrict the flow after the pump nor do I want to bleed off any of the outflow, seems to me I should be able to adjust the psi by using the provided adjustment. Looking at the drawing can I expect to get a valid psi reading with the guage setup where it is just past the outflow? The guage is the type used on the head of a pool filter, I am thinking that unless I can seal the tank so it can pressureize I won't get a correct reading? Arrrga, maybe I should just break down and buy a coolmate 3
                        Attached Files
                        Regards, George

                        Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
                        Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
                        Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

                        Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
                        Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          George I dont think the tank will need to be pressurized. You will need to have thew torch installed after the pressure gauge as the resistance to water flow by the torch will affect the reading. Think of putting your thumb over the end of a garden hose. Sound like you have the battle almost won. Don,t give up the ship now.

                          Dennis
                          Dennis


                          Thermal Arc 185-TSW
                          Millermatic Challenger 172
                          VictorO/A
                          Atlas Craftsman 12 by 24 Lathe
                          Esab PCM-875
                          Wholesale Tool Mill-Drill

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by tailshaft56
                            George I dont think the tank will need to be pressurized. You will need to have thew torch installed after the pressure gauge as the resistance to water flow by the torch will affect the reading. Think of putting your thumb over the end of a garden hose. Sound like you have the battle almost won. Don,t give up the ship now.

                            Dennis
                            Thanks, I can get a #20 torch to check it with from my friend.
                            Regards, George

                            Hobart Handler 210 w/DP3035 - Great 240V small Mig
                            Hobart Handler 140 - Great 120V Mig
                            Hobart Handler EZ125 - IMO the best 120V Flux Core only machine

                            Miller Dynasty 200DX with cooler of my design, works for me
                            Miller Spectrum 375 - Nice Cutter

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              George,

                              That's a strange arrangement in my mind. I've never seen a pressure regulator that worked on the suction side of the pump! Unless that's a two-stage pump, and the pressure regulator is on the output of the first stage, I don't understand how it works! I can buy that the device could throttle the volume of the suction port's intake, and therefore reduce the output volume with the ascociated drop in pressure, but I don't see how it works! I'm gonna try to google that pump and see what I don't know about it!

                              Hank
                              ...from the Gadget Garage
                              Millermatic 210 w/3035, BWE
                              Handler 210 w/DP3035
                              TA185TSW
                              Victor O/A "J" series, SuperRange

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X