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  • Old Econo Twin HF

    Hey all, I bought an Econo twin HF with a tig torch but nonfoot pedal for $200. It’s in very good shape. I asked several people about it and they said it was a junk budget welder but I tried it at the sellers house and it welded smoothly. I printed out the manual and it says it has a 60% duty cycle. I would like to have a few more amps but this thing seems to run darn good. I searched the threads for posts and there are some old ones. I was just wanting opinions on the old welder. It’s a JA-41swrial #........
    HH 210MVP
    Spoolrunner 100
    Powercraft AC buzz box
    Lotas LTP5000D plasma
    Victor Oxy/Acet
    30 ton press
    A few brand name tools
    Lots of no name tools
    A wife to worry me
    and 4 dogs to supervise me

  • #2
    My buddy has one and it welds great. For $200 I would have bought it in a minute...Bob
    Bob Wright

    Spool Gun conversion. How To Do It. Below.
    http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...php?albumid=48

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    • #3
      Ok thanks. I wanted a DC welder so I could weld outside on older equipment and I found this. I may try to build a foot pedal and use it on some light tig projects also. I’ve never tigbwelded before but always up to learning something..
      HH 210MVP
      Spoolrunner 100
      Powercraft AC buzz box
      Lotas LTP5000D plasma
      Victor Oxy/Acet
      30 ton press
      A few brand name tools
      Lots of no name tools
      A wife to worry me
      and 4 dogs to supervise me

      Comment


      • #4
        Once you learn to tig weld, you'll tig as much that makes sense as you can. It is an excellent process. Get you a foot pedal for it. It's not junk, but it's a more budget friendly machine than many others Miller has made. I'm with Bob, I would've snatched it up for $200. Not that I need it, but I'm sure I'd find someone I know who could use a good deal on a machine.

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        • #5
          Not sure a foot pedal was available for that machine. So you might be on your own there.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by FusionKing View Post
            Not sure a foot pedal was available for that machine. So you might be on your own there.
            Yeah, I didn't see a way to hook one in either.

            https://www.millerwelds.com/files/ow.../O302J_MIL.pdf

            Looks like it's built more like a MIG power source than a TIG. You can do remote on/off but I see no mechanism to vary the current beyond the high/low switch.
            Last edited by MasterKwan; 09-10-2018, 10:01 AM. Reason: Spelling

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            • #7
              Agree. The wiring diagram shows no way to hook up a foot pedal. Current is controlled by a movable shunt like a Thunderbolt. Short of haywiring a stepper motor to the shunt drive ( which wouldn't be responsive enough to be effective anyway) no remote control is possible. But I still think you got a good deal on it as a stick welder.

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              • #8
                So an on-off switch Velcro-ed to the handle is all he gets....I have one I used several years ago for a set up like this. I have just the switch and the plug that fits the newer 16 pin socket (I think). You can have it. It wasn't cheap either. You'll need to modify the plug for whatever socket is on that old machine though.

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                • #9
                  In regards to a foot pedal, I'll stand up and say I don't see why you couldn't?

                  1) use a foot pedal for the on off contactor at the very least.
                  2) figure out how to vary the fixed out put current even if it required a few additional somethings to do it?

                  As I see it, while you would max out to what the crank has been set to be for current out put, due to the shunt design, why couldn't that current then not be varied? Like adding a dimmer to a light bulb?
                  Admittedly I know little more then to question why not? Not interested enough to start researching diagrams either? But I did think is was a bit simpler to do then to just think it couldn't be done?

                  I do question it some what selfishly however, as I have an old Lincoln pedal brand new in a box, as well a old Hobart rheostat remote again new, bought surplus thinking how hard could it be to cross reference wires and read a diagram?

                  All that said, if I could pick up a Econo Twin HF for $200, I'd be on it as well.
                  As for comments, AC GTAW is old school aluminum with a unbalanced wave, 50% duty cycle @150 amps means you're still welding pretty steady with 1/8" rods, and as far as things go, it'll never blow a circuit board.
                  I'd say you got a deal.


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                  • #10
                    Assuming the manual link MasterKwan provided is correct for this machine (and it certainly seems to be), there isn't even a plug to hook an on/off switch to because there is no circuitry in the machine to turn on and off other than the main power and the HF; no weld control relays like Helga has. The only plug on the front is for a remote HF on/off switch. This is really a muscled--up Thunderbolt in a bigger package with HF added for scratch start TIG. I would expect it to be a great stick machine, but not one with any capability at all for remote control of weld current. Still think it was a smokin' deal for $200. You could still TIG with it but it won't be easy, and you'd have to hack together a relay-operated valve for control of the gas.

                    While I was typing, Noel suggested a foot pedal on the on/off contactor. Unfortunately, this machine has no on/off contactor; only a main power switch. I suppose you could put a contactor in the primary circuit, but I'd want to put some snubbers around the transformer if you were switching the primary on and off while welding. Not an approach I would recommend. A normal foot pedal has the weld current at min or zero before turning the contactor on and off. e = -L di/dt, and the voltage spikes could get pretty large. That formula describes the process that allows an old Kettering ignition system to generate 15,000 volts from a 6v battery in an old car. While admittedly the turns ratio on the welder transformer is nowhere near that in an old car coil, the same basic principle applies. If it was my transformer, I wouldn't try it. Just my thoughts....someone here may have gotten away with it just fine....ya never know.
                    Last edited by Aeronca41; 09-10-2018, 04:48 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Aeronca41 View Post
                      Agree. The wiring diagram shows no way to hook up a foot pedal. Current is controlled by a movable shunt like a Thunderbolt. Short of haywiring a stepper motor to the shunt drive
                      My buddy called Miller back a few years ago about a foot pedal. And this is what he was told " go down to the local zoo and get a monkey and a bag of peanuts. When you want the amps moved holler at the monkey and have him turn the crank" is exactly what he was told. I was sitting there...Bob
                      Bob Wright

                      Spool Gun conversion. How To Do It. Below.
                      http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...php?albumid=48

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by aametalmaster View Post

                        My buddy called Miller back a few years ago about a foot pedal. And this is what he was told " go down to the local zoo and get a monkey and a bag of peanuts. When you want the amps moved holler at the monkey and have him turn the crank" is exactly what he was told. I was sitting there...Bob
                        That is great--and the monkey would be potentially more entertaining than a stepper motor..... Thanks, Bob!

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                        • #13
                          Only issue I see with the monkey method is if you dip the tungsten he may throw poo at you.
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                          • #14
                            Ha!

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                            • #15
                              https://www.millerwelds.com/files/ow.../O315U_MIL.pdf

                              I took my kids caddy for a ride today. You don't know how rough your living it until you sit on heated seats. I told him if I every finish my hot rod it would have heated seats.

                              I've attached the Miller site link viewing a manual for a dial arc. Big brother to the E-Twin or more appropriately, something more money would have bought back in the same day. Being the first to admit I have a rudimentary knowledge at best about such things as the schematics shows, I'm still of the belief and seemingly in agreement with the monkey story, complicated yes, doable possibly, worth the effort, doubtful.

                              https://www.millerwelds.com/files/ow.../O610S_MIL.pdf

                              Sometimes there is an easier way?

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