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Diversion 180 Settings for Cast Alum

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  • H80N
    replied
    Originally posted by H80N View Post

    This would be a mistake & doomed to failure.....

    Find a way to bolt it in
    STILL....Just Sayin................... Bolt or Clamp it....

    Welding Dissimilar metals..Aluminum-to-Steel=. NO Bueno......
    Last edited by H80N; 07-29-2017, 08:41 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Crepe Myrtle Farmer
    replied
    Originally posted by H80N View Post

    This would be a mistake & doomed to failure.....

    Find a way to bolt it in

    The frame involved is the original frame that was brazed to the original radiator's tanks, then bolted to the truck's front end clip.

    The frame acts like a "clamp" ( [ ] ) restricting the radiator's movement left/right, up/down -- the real hold down forces are thru the bolts into the front clip. The brazing is actually a "puddle" build up through drilled holes in the steel clamps ( [ ] ) into the alum radiator. I might just use the 180 w/4043 as an option.

    Did something very similar on another diesel truck and it's held up for going on four years now.

    My Miller products keep me in business -- really like the quality, durability, dependability.

    Leave a comment:


  • H80N
    replied
    Originally posted by Crepe Myrtle Farmer View Post


    My next project is brazing a new alum radiator (Champion) into my F-600 Dump Truck's steel radiator frame --- tinning the steel with silver brazing material then using aluminum brazing material 4047 to join the dissimilar materials.
    This would be a mistake & doomed to failure.....

    Find a way to bolt it in

    Leave a comment:


  • Crepe Myrtle Farmer
    replied
    Originally posted by H80N View Post
    BTW The hobart maxal aluminum handbook is worth downloading... reading & keeping for reference

    http://maxal.com/files/QuickSiteImag...g_9-12_doc.pdf



    The only major obstacle might be the relatively low power of your welder...
    but you could overcome that with some preheat... and possibly a Helium/Argon gas mix

    Excellent document. Thank You for posting. Preheat plus the Diversion 180 should get the job done -- this "little" box is awfully mighty handy.

    My next project is brazing a new alum radiator (Champion) into my F-600 Dump Truck's steel radiator frame --- tinning the steel with silver brazing material then using aluminum brazing material 4047 to join the dissimilar materials.

    Leave a comment:


  • Crepe Myrtle Farmer
    replied
    Originally posted by H80N View Post
    The trans case is probably 356 alloy..... readily weldable with proper cleaning and preparation

    I would go with 4943 filler as Ryan & FusionKing have suggested... It flows beautifully and has plenty of strength..
    Also.... 4943 is not temp restricted as 5356 is

    http://www.hobartbrothers.com/upload...Maxal_4943.pdf

    How about some pics of the parts you intend to weld....??


    I spoke to a 30-yr Ford Master Tech I know and he said the same thing --- 356 alloy from what he remembered. Thank you.

    Leave a comment:


  • H80N
    replied
    BTW The hobart maxal aluminum handbook is worth downloading... reading & keeping for reference

    http://maxal.com/files/QuickSiteImag...g_9-12_doc.pdf



    The only major obstacle might be the relatively low power of your welder...
    but you could overcome that with some preheat... and possibly a Helium/Argon gas mix

    Leave a comment:


  • H80N
    replied
    The trans case is probably 356 alloy..... readily weldable with proper cleaning and preparation

    I would go with 4943 filler as Ryan & FusionKing have suggested... It flows beautifully and has plenty of strength..
    Also.... 4943 is not temp restricted as 5356 is

    http://www.hobartbrothers.com/upload...Maxal_4943.pdf

    How about some pics of the parts you intend to weld....??
    Last edited by H80N; 07-26-2017, 09:36 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Silverback
    replied
    Originally posted by Arizona Joe View Post
    For the alloy content did you contact ford.com? There is a contact number where they say they will answer questions. Also, there are probably numerous clubs who have knowledgeable members to answer your question.

    Lastly, I just chanced upon the video below about welding aluminum, especially castings with Pete Zila. I know nothing about this topic but found the video to be enlightening, interesting and believable.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ir-pS7GzT28

    Cheers
    LOL, as soon as I saw the title of this thread I was going to link that video.

    I don't know what this 4R70W is in, but there's plenty of them around, why not just get another one? If the trans is something special going in something special then get a JY case and swap internals. If it isn't then just get one from the JY and swap it in. I know that this is a welding site, but by the time you manage to weld this thing back together I doubt everything will line up right, which is a sure way to end up with driveline problems and a dead trans (well, I can think of one way to do it, bolt it to a spare block to hold it all in place) and between the gunk soaked into the porous casting and the fact that an aluminum weld is never as strong as the base metal you'll be lucky if what you end up with is 1/4-1/3 as strong as it started before it broke. You'll have wasted a ton of time and effort for something that will likely never be right.

    If you still insist on doing it use all the pre-heat you can get, it will help get some of the crud out of the casting, then I would try the 5356 first, but that's really a crap shoot, a weld on an unknown grade of aluminum could end up looking good and crack off when you bolt it down.

    Leave a comment:


  • Meltedmetal
    replied
    Originally posted by FusionKing View Post
    # 1 Don't use brake cleaner......it can KILL you if mixed with argon!!! I prefer "purple cleaner" myself
    The use of chlorinated cleaners can kill you and it is important to recognize the risk, but it is not the presence of argon but more likely the heat that can produce toxic gases. From the CDC:
    • Phosgene can be formed when chlorinated hydrocarbon compounds are exposed to high temperatures. Chlorinated hydrocarbon compounds are substances sometimes used or created in industry that contain the elements chlorine, hydrogen, and carbon.
    • The vapors of chlorinated solvents exposed to high temperatures have been known to produce phosgene. Chlorinated solvents are chlorine-containing chemicals that are typically used in industrial processes to dissolve or clean other materials, such as in paint stripping, metal cleaning, and dry cleaning.

    https://emergency.cdc.gov/agent/phos...sics/facts.asp

    Leave a comment:


  • Arizona Joe
    replied
    For the alloy content did you contact ford.com? There is a contact number where they say they will answer questions. Also, there are probably numerous clubs who have knowledgeable members to answer your question.

    Lastly, I just chanced upon the video below about welding aluminum, especially castings with Pete Zila. I know nothing about this topic but found the video to be enlightening, interesting and believable.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ir-pS7GzT28

    Cheers
    Last edited by Arizona Joe; 07-25-2017, 10:48 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Crepe Myrtle Farmer
    replied
    Originally posted by ryanjones2150 View Post
    I have had good luck recently using Hobart 4943 on aluminum castings. It wets out nicer and just better, but that's just my experience with the two. And I have run the 4943 and the 4043 side by side on the same job for comparison.

    Aluminum castings are always a bit of a gamble. Without knowing the alloy used in the casting, you could be just making a mess out of things. But hey, it's already broke, why not give her **** eh?

    Some preheat will probably won't hurt either. At least burn out some of the schmoo in there.

    I had heard Hobart's wire was very good quality. I'm not happy with the stuff Airgas has been selling me at their retail location.

    Leave a comment:


  • Crepe Myrtle Farmer
    replied
    Many thanks to all. Sure wish there was a way to determine alloys used in the parts the welding community repairs. I poured some vinegar on the housing and didn't get any "fizz", tried burning shavings with my torch and no ignition so I've eliminated magnesium content, but after there I'm out of options to narrow down the alloy (aluminum).

    It really matters matching up filler to the material being TIG'd, MIG'd, etc. Thanks again to all.

    Leave a comment:


  • FusionKing
    replied
    # 1 Don't use brake cleaner......it can KILL you if mixed with argon!!! I prefer "purple cleaner" myself
    #2 Tack part leaving "some" of the original so it still fits like a puzzle but with a lot of beveling
    #3 as Ryan said, preheat the crap out of it !!
    #4 as Ryan said, use 4943
    It would be nice if you had a machine that you could turn down the frequency to 60hz and the balance to 50%. The results would be much nicer.

    Leave a comment:


  • aametalmaster
    replied
    And if it bubbles up from all of the tranny fluid grind it out and start over...Bob

    Leave a comment:


  • ryanjones2150
    replied
    I have had good luck recently using Hobart 4943 on aluminum castings. It wets out nicer and just better, but that's just my experience with the two. And I have run the 4943 and the 4043 side by side on the same job for comparison.

    Aluminum castings are always a bit of a gamble. Without knowing the alloy used in the casting, you could be just making a mess out of things. But hey, it's already broke, why not give her **** eh?

    Some preheat will probably won't hurt either. At least burn out some of the schmoo in there.

    Leave a comment:

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