Advantage of multi voltage machines?

[Old Guy]

Is there any advantage to having a multi voltage welder if you will not need to move it?

The Miller 190 runs on 240v and the Miller 211 runs on both 110v and 240v. Other than being able to run on 110v is there any other advantage to having a dual voltage machine?

Is there a time when 110v would be better? I am assuming the 190 and the 211 are the same machine except one can run on dual voltage.

If you are running the 190 on 240v can't you just turn the power down to the same level as the 211 would be running on 110v?

[Aeronca41]

Those two machines are close, but are apparently not exactly the same. On the low end, both are rated down to 30 amps, and recommended down to 24 ga. metal. In that area, there is no advantage to the 211. However, the 190 is rated at up to 190 amps, while the 211 is rated to 230 amps, with the resultant top-end welding specs to 5/16" on the 190 and 3/8" on the 211. IMHO, that is not a huge difference, but might matter to some. The duty cycle on the 211 is a bit better. All of that aside, I have never heard a person say they bought "too much" welder; I have heard many say they bought too little. With the rebate on the 211, I would suspect you could get the prices pretty close with some dedicated shopping. And there have been times in my life where I "knew" I would never need a certain capability, saved a few bucks, and later found that capability I could have purchased for only a few bucks more would have come in really handy. Also, comparing current draw from the power line, you're looking at 5 KVA for the 190 at rated output vs. 4 KVA for the 211--that's 20% less input power required to produce more welding power. Depends on how much you weld to determine whether that is significant enough to worry about. I'd recommend the 211, but that's just me.

[ryanjones2150]

OG...I see no clear advantage to a dual voltage machine other than being dual voltage. I also can't think of any reason that powering something on 115v would make it "better" than its 230v capability. It's just a tiny bit more versatile. But if the machine will not be moved the dual voltage serves you no purpose and you can get an even bigger machine!

[OscarJr]

Exactly. Absolutely nothing besides voltage versatility is gained by using on 120 vs 240V.

[MAC702]

Agreed. It's only for power input convenience and options. 240V is the preferred input for ANY job, and the required input for big jobs.

[Old Guy]

Thanks everyone... I see a few people saying 110V is the only way to go for thin sheet metal but the vast majority say 110V welders are basically worthless.

[OscarJr]

The real question is: who have you been talking to?

The main question you should be concerning yourself with is: Can a particular welder be dialed down to weld 0.XXX" thickness that I will be working with? Once you have the answer to that question for the welder in question, voltage input into the machine whether 120 or 240V is irrelevant.

[FusionKing]

I cannot hardly believe they even make a 190
Let alone its 240v only
I would buy the 211. Once you get it, there will sooner or later be a reason to take it somewhere and run it on 120v.
And it will always sell better.
And if they drop the 190, you can bet the 211 will be better resale.
I would certainly buy a Hobart 210 before I bought a miller 190. That's IMHO....YMMV

[Old Guy]

I cannot hardly believe they even make a 190
Let alone its 240v only
I would buy the 211. Once you get it, there will sooner or later be a reason to take it somewhere and run it on 120v.
And it will always sell better.
And if they drop the 190, you can bet the 211 will be better resale.
I would certainly buy a Hobart 210 before I bought a miller 190. That's IMHO....YMMV

I'm actually waiting for a deal on a Hobart 210. I don't see a whole lot of love for inverter machines either. : )

[Aeronca41]

Good choice.

[OscarJr]

I'm actually waiting for a deal on a Hobart 210. I don't see a whole lot of love for inverter machines either. : )

Not at the prices people try to sell them for, even if it is a Miller. A used machine is exactly that, plus it is almost always 99.9995% out of warranty. Then people try to get nearly ~90% of what they sell for right now, not ~90% of what was paid for it when it was purchased, let alone that figure being way too high. Go figure. Just look at the thread over on weldingweb titled "craigslist crack-smokers". Full of people trying to get like-new prices for ancient equipment and the like.

Just look at these sold listings from Ebay for a 200dx. None of them sold for the asking price, except one where it was a bid.



I absolutely love my inverter welders, but know very well I will never make anywhere even close to what I paid for them, heck even if they were still in warranty. The last welder I got rid off was an Eastwood TIG200 AC/DC and I was lucky to get ~$350 for it. No way I would ever try to sell my current equipment should I ever want to upgrade, which I will eventually. And it will be an inverter. Either a 280dx or a Dynasty 400. Maybe even one of them fancy german TIGs with a 15,000pps pulser.

[Old Guy]

Oscar you sure got this right!!! Almost every used machine I see has a asking price as high or higher than I can get a new one online for!!
Especially the Miller 211 transformer model. Then again I think the new ones are higher than a giraffes a**.

[Old Guy]

The real question is: who have you been talking to?

I used to be the maintenance manager for a very large beverage factory. I worked every day with pipe fitters that could do things with a welder most people probably can't imagine like fabricating stainless steel lines and fittings so perfectly you couldn't find a seam.

Those guys (we are all retired now) laugh at these new machines and all the auto settings. I remember their favorite machine was a old Miller with 4 taps. Even today they still say "Thats all you need, its in the wire speed." I have to believe them.

Those guys were artists.

[OscarJr]

Welding ability doesn't always translate into knowledge of modern machines. Of course they will like their older machines, same reason we always like the music we grew up listening to and like the cars that were around when we were younger. The young(er) mind is always more impressionable and these things that were a big part of our lives at a younger age we are more comfortable with. Your buddies can point and laugh all they want, but I bet you they wouldn't taunt a room full of PhD electrical engineers/physicists at Miller who are not re-introducing old Miller 4-tap machines into the current market, hobbyist or otherwise. Unless I missed it on the Miller website.....

Of course you are free to believe who you want, it's your perogative. But so far, I have yet to see anyone pop up here and claim their point of view about "110V is the way to go". So here it comes and you're not gonna like it but......

I'm calling you out now. You said you have to believe "them" who told you "110V is the way to go", yet in your very first post, you questioned their advice yourself when you asked

"If you are running the 190 on 240v can't you just turn the power down..."

So if you "have to believe them" as you say, why post the initial question? Not trying to be harsh/mean/etc. Just pointing out facts. You really did answer your own question by asking that. If a machine can be dialed down to properly weld a specific weld joint, it matters not what the input voltage is, it will be suitable for you, which is what you were already thinking in the back of your mind.

Am I good or what?

Oh and the new 211 absolutely rocks. When you get it dialed in, it welds like a dream. Smooth.

[Old Guy]

Good rant! 9/10 but you got lost somewhere. Read post 6 again. No one I know ever recommended a 110V machine. I have only seen a few (very few) people online (that I do not know) saying 110V is good for light sheet metal.

To much welding fumes?