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MM252 Recommended Mig settings for 3/16" steel joints?

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  • FusionKing
    replied
    Cut some scrap. Make some joints. Don't practice out in the middle of a sheet. That means nothing. Try 18 volts and 200 wire feed. Then work your way hotter to a balance of control comfort and penetration.

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  • FusionKing
    replied
    Originally posted by clint738 View Post

    This is the weld I was thinking had a high bead profile... wasn't sure if you saw this one, or the last one where it was a corner joint with a gap running down hill.
    I didn't really have a lot of material overhang to consider it like a true overhead T-joint.... but it was too much material overhang to just do a straight horizontal weld.. Laid it down and welded it flat after getting tired of the weld bead seeming too high.
    That is what I called your first welds in my post. I would've flipped it over. Strange joint but still doable. Even good guys would complain about welding that one.

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  • clint738
    replied
    Originally posted by FusionKing View Post
    Looks too hot to me.
    I wouldn't call that a high bead profile.
    You are talking about travel speed being higher than stick makes me raise an eyebrow pretty quick.
    Miller used to say the door setting was for a "T" joint. That requires more heat than most.
    Not really sure what it is you are trying to accomplish here, but simply looking at the "V" shape to your bead, and the end crater shape, tells me you are simply flying to the point of barely being able to keep up with it. If it was say 1/2" thick, then maybe I would say in one pass that was a look I would want.
    When I look at my 350P chart I go down one full metal thickness size on the chart than recommended for my starting point, just because they want it so stinkin' hot.
    As far as your "gap" goes......I don't believe you really need that because that would be really thin there anyway.
    I see my advice may be completely 180 degrees from what you may or may not think. I just know how I get the bead appearance I like to see.
    I would like more pics up close and some of the back side too.
    On those first welds I would have been more inclined to turn the part completely upside down for that joint. It would have burned in lots nicer without worry of loosing the edge.
    Just my observations. I hope that helps some. Play with scrap (like Mac said)
    This is the weld I was thinking had a high bead profile... wasn't sure if you saw this one, or the last one where it was a corner joint with a gap running down hill.





    I didn't really have a lot of material overhang to consider it like a true overhead T-joint.... but it was too much material overhang to just do a straight horizontal weld.. Laid it down and welded it flat after getting tired of the weld bead seeming too high.

    Leave a comment:


  • clint738
    replied
    Originally posted by FusionKing View Post
    Looks too hot to me.
    I wouldn't call that a high bead profile.
    You are talking about travel speed being higher than stick makes me raise an eyebrow pretty quick.
    Miller used to say the door setting was for a "T" joint. That requires more heat than most.
    Not really sure what it is you are trying to accomplish here, but simply looking at the "V" shape to your bead, and the end crater shape, tells me you are simply flying to the point of barely being able to keep up with it. If it was say 1/2" thick, then maybe I would say in one pass that was a look I would want.
    When I look at my 350P chart I go down one full metal thickness size on the chart than recommended for my starting point, just because they want it so stinkin' hot.
    As far as your "gap" goes......I don't believe you really need that because that would be really thin there anyway.
    I see my advice may be completely 180 degrees from what you may or may not think. I just know how I get the bead appearance I like to see.
    I would like more pics up close and some of the back side too.
    On those first welds I would have been more inclined to turn the part completely upside down for that joint. It would have burned in lots nicer without worry of loosing the edge.
    Just my observations. I hope that helps some. Play with scrap (like Mac said)
    Sadly, the piece of material tacked on top was my practice piece to try to get my heat set and have a place to attach my ground.
    I ran beads at different settings.. voltage and wire feed and then would look at the heat signature made on the back of the plate.

    After about 2 beads I'd quench that practice plate with water cool it back down, so I didn't get a false indication of enough penetration from the plate heating up.

    If no heat signature was present, I'd turn up the machine. So I guess that may be why it seems hot. I just don't trust Mig enough to see a pretty weld and know it has good penetration.

    Ideally, I'm shooting for passes that would resemble 7018 stick welds in appearance.



    If I knew any welders that did this for a living nearby... I'd buy them a case of beer if they watch me lay some beads and help me get this Mig dialed in.

    Really looking to learn how to acid etch welds too if I can score a horizontal band saw to dice coupons up.

    Leave a comment:


  • FusionKing
    replied
    Looks too hot to me.
    I wouldn't call that a high bead profile.
    You are talking about travel speed being higher than stick makes me raise an eyebrow pretty quick.
    Miller used to say the door setting was for a "T" joint. That requires more heat than most.
    Not really sure what it is you are trying to accomplish here, but simply looking at the "V" shape to your bead, and the end crater shape, tells me you are simply flying to the point of barely being able to keep up with it. If it was say 1/2" thick, then maybe I would say in one pass that was a look I would want.
    When I look at my 350P chart I go down one full metal thickness size on the chart than recommended for my starting point, just because they want it so stinkin' hot.
    As far as your "gap" goes......I don't believe you really need that because that would be really thin there anyway.
    I see my advice may be completely 180 degrees from what you may or may not think. I just know how I get the bead appearance I like to see.
    I would like more pics up close and some of the back side too.
    On those first welds I would have been more inclined to turn the part completely upside down for that joint. It would have burned in lots nicer without worry of loosing the edge.
    Just my observations. I hope that helps some. Play with scrap (like Mac said)

    Leave a comment:


  • clint738
    replied
    Well, I did a little more adjusting and found I think the joint fit up has more to do with the bead height than my machine settings. Here was a bead height profile I was pleased with. However, the flat butt joint welds with no gap, I'm still searching for the ideal welder settings to make the bead not so high.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sc/z1bovji43...Y18gNEOyLpy93a

    I know there is some undercut showing... something I have always struggled with actually even when stick welding.
    https://www.dropbox.com/sc/nli5i674m...pZMs-l_vx8K0xa

    But I'm guessing having the fit up with the nice gap between rather than touching 90 degree joint allowed for the bead a place to lay within rather than on top.

    Machine set at 19.4V 265 ipm

    https://www.dropbox.com/sc/0vi8q7tvv...TxWBgvNh_8hEda


    Last edited by clint738; 02-13-2017, 02:21 PM.

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  • tackit
    replied
    When I'm flat welding, I turn the voltage up one volt more than whats shown on the door and the machine welds perfectly. I listen to the arc when setting my wire speed, I use the door numbers just to get close, then I turn the wire feed speed knob up or down until I hear a steady smooth sizzling bacon sound, then I have the sweet spot I'm looking for..
    Last edited by tackit; 02-08-2017, 12:08 PM.

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  • Danny
    replied
    Try removing the mill scale and rust from your base metal in your weld zone area. Doing this should help improve arc quality , puddle wet out, and penetration.

    Leave a comment:


  • ryanjones2150
    replied
    A long stick-out will make your weld crown up like that too, especially out of position.

    Leave a comment:


  • MMW
    replied
    It looks to me that you are trying to keep the puddle centered on the joint? In this instance you should be favoring the lower plate slightly as there is less mass on the top pc. so it will burn in easier there on the edge as opposed to the bottom plate. As you weld you can always roll the puddle up to catch the top then back down, basically weaving. Hope you understand what I'm saying.

    Don't be afraid to change the machine settings until you find your sweet spot. Two people can use the same machine and have different settings. All charts are just a guideline & require tweaking.

    Leave a comment:


  • MAC702
    replied
    It's been so long since I used a machine that gave me the actual numbers, that I couldn't tell you. Experiment both directions and see what differences you get. Surely you have a few scraps so you don't have a bad a weld on the project?
    Last edited by MAC702; 02-07-2017, 08:44 AM. Reason: spelling

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  • clint738
    replied
    I agree MAC that welding flat will be nicer. I was just welding the horizontals to get some practice with the machine again since I hadn't uncovered it since probably 2015.

    For 3/16" plate material which voltage and wire speed feed would your recommend to get LOTs of penetration?

    Leave a comment:


  • MAC702
    replied
    Originally posted by clint738 View Post
    ...Can someone refresh my memory of what the wire feed adjusts versus the voltage?...
    To put it simply, wire speed is your amperage. The faster you pour in the wire, the higher current the machine will put into the weld, within its capabilities at the selected voltage.

    And while it might be a pain with such a large and heavy weldment, after you get it tacked together, you might want to attempt moving the safe around so that your production welds are in the flat position. Even though you can weld in the other positions, flat is always nicer.

    Leave a comment:


  • clint738
    replied
    I was especially wondering about the welder door settings since they are SO far off of the Mig calculator.

    18.4V at 265 ipm

    or 18-19V at 320-340 ipm

    That seems like a lot of variation in the wire feed speed?


    Can someone refresh my memory of what the wire feed adjusts versus the voltage?

    I am just spoiled to the single amps dial on stick I guess.

    Thanks!

    Leave a comment:


  • tackit
    replied
    It's mostly experimenting with the heat settings, wire speed and travel speed, you'll find the combination easy enough through trial and error. The settings on the door more than likely are for flat welding, so in your situation they're hotter than you need/want.
    Last edited by tackit; 02-06-2017, 11:58 AM.

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