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4043 + 3003 = ?

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Blown S-10,

    It looks good from here!

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  • Blown S-10
    replied
    i sand the livin crap out of it with 220, then 400, then 800. then i buff it on my 8" buffer. parts come out pretty good, not super duper show quality, but not bad at all. and thats good enough for me.

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Mike,

    Thanks for the compliments. There is always next weekend. I try for the free weekend thing on the cell phone or after 9:00 in the evening. I bought AlcoTec filler in the 4145, 4047, and 1100. The 4145 is not too bad @ < $15.00/lb. I appreciate your input on this filler and the link. I am anxious to give it a try. I have to ask. 5183???

    Ford has done some testing with hydrofroming of 6061 tubing. They seem to have considerable problems with defromation and bursting at low test parameters. Thanks for the additional information.

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  • Blackplague
    replied
    This post is going to be real wordy!!!

    Hawk,
    Sorry about not getting to call you this weekend, I'm ear deep in welding projects and had to get them out the door.

    Most people will say that 4145 isn't any good for 3003 to 3003, but it works well. What i like about it is that it has a low melting point {lower than 1100,4043,and 4047} which for me, works real good with thin sheets, heat exchangers, tanks, etc. The 4145 also is less susceptible to heat cracks during welding and shrinkage cracks during the cool down. You can use it as a brazing rod or a tig rod. It lays down like 1100, but the over all weld is stronger. The downside is cost and availability {i'm sure there are more} !! It's not a real common rod though. Here is a neat link: http://www.alcotec.com/atasap.pdf

    I use what i like to call freak rods { uncommon alloy rods } all the time. Don't even ask what i use 5183 for.


    The thing with 6061 in any form {0 - T6} is it doesn't enlongate well { stretch}. When you bend it cold, you'll start to see cracking in the grain structure {even if it's bent with the grain}. From what i've seen in the tube and pipe journals is that hydroformed they are getting about 12% enlongation before the tube splits I don't know what applications they are trying to get 6061 tube to go in though.

    I also have to agree with one of the other post's today Hawk, You are a wealth of knowledge and one he#* of a welder. A tip of the cap to you!!!

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Blown S-10,

    How are you polishing your pieces?

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  • Blown S-10
    replied
    i found out how well the 3003 matched the 4043. the beads were to fix bad spots, then ground, sanded and polished to look like nothing had ever been done. that was the "plan" anyway. it blended well enough, but i can still see were the repairs are. though i don't think anyone else would, unless i pointed it out. it was easy to see, before i polished it.

    ya know. i have bent 6061 before. for brackets, pieces like 1"x.125"x? . to a sharp bend. some sandpaper made it look like it was meant to be like it was. so i guess it depends on the bend.

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  • joebass
    replied
    I have a fair anount of 1/8 inch aluminum bent for me in a press brake and its 5052. 6061 is too hard to get a sharp bends and will fracture. There are some tricks like a igger radius bend and bending against the grain.

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Blackplague,

    On the subject of bending aluminum: What do you know about hydroforming 6061 series tubes?

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Blown S-10,

    I found the 4145 for $14.65/lb. From everything I have read it is not recommended for 3003 to 3003. However, Blackplague says it works well so I am going to try it and compare since I don't use 3003 for anything critical. If you are interested in the results and where to buy, let me know.

    I don't bend aluminum, but here is a online metal bending discussion you may want to check out concerning 6061. I have read 6063-T53 had good bending properties. I am intersted in what you find that works.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blown S-10
    replied
    hey guys. is there a better aluminum that has the same, or better, properties as 3003h14 ? it needs to be bendable.

    HAWK. i saw you post the price of that 4145.
    i don't think i will be trying that for a while, if ever. how much does the 1100 go for ?

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  • Blown S-10
    replied
    one of my local supplies doesn't carry 1100 (didn't think to ask if they could get it ). i will call the other monday.

    this is the part that i am (re)making, but better. square box on top of engine. as you can see, it needs to be polished and GOOD looking. i made some good progress on it last night.
    Attached Files

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  • Paul Seaman
    replied
    I've only worked with the more common aluminum alloys, 4043, 6061 so if you have pics of the color match I would really like to see the difference.

    Thanks

    Leave a comment:


  • HAWK
    replied
    Blown S-10,

    The 4047 is also a very high Si content rod.

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Originally posted by Blackplague
    Here is a link to the Crown Alloys technical application guide:
    http://www.crownalloys.com/page07.pdf

    Blown S-10, is this going to be for a plenum or valve covers? Hawk is right on the 1100 filler. Because 1100 has a very small amounts of silicon, once you joing it with 3003 {which has a fair amount of silicon} it should even out the silicon content around the weld area, which means if you go to anodize the part ,the color will be even through out. Silicon in the filler or base metal makes the color lighter {when a part is anodized}, that's why most will recommend 5356 when welding say,6061 as opposed to 4043.

    Now the rod {R4145} Hawk and i have talked about has way too much silicon if you plan on anodizing. If you plan on polishing the part it would be ok.

    Hawk >> I'll give you a call this weekend if that would be ok.
    Mike,

    [email protected] for the phone number. I don't know if you still have it??

    Yeah. Give me a call. Anytime after 9 Eastern Standard on SATURDAY is good. I have to drop the Chevy off for trans service in the AM.


    Also Crown told me today they do not recommend the 4145 for joining 3003 to itself. The say it is for joining 3003 to 2219, but I think they are hiding something.

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  • HAWK
    replied
    Originally posted by joebass
    HAWK, Let me know how that place works out. How much are you ordering? I have been looking for a place to get a few pounds of some 4047 and some Ni99 Rod as the local guys can only get 10 pounds at a time.
    Joebass,

    I contacted Crown Alloys about the 4145, 4047, and 1100 fillers. They have all of them as well as the Nickel99 and several hundred other fillers from stick and tig to brazing rods and fluxes. They have a large SELECTION. Crown Alloys will not sell direct. I spoke with several distributors and found prices that seem to reflect "paying for a name". I have not had time to check, but I wonder if they manufacture or just warehouse the material under their name.

    I did some searching and ordered the 4145, 4047, and 1100 from an AlcoTec distributor in the Carolinas. The prices are less than half of Crown and the specs are the same. I should have it all in 1-2 weeks shipped complete. I ordered 2 lbs of 4145 and 3 lbs each of the 4047 and 1100. I will let you know about the 4145 when I get it.

    This distributor will sell in 1 pound increments if that is what you are looking to buy. Their price per pound in small quantities in competitive.

    Leave a comment:

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