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Flux Core -VS- Shielding Gas

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    fun4now
    Senior Member

  • fun4now
    replied
    change

    remember when you are trying bolth types of wire (shielded and flux) that you need to change your torch from + to - as you go back and forth i forgot this once and spent about an houre trying to get a good bead diled in befor i opend the box and relised what i had done.
    good luck

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  • klsm54
    Senior Member

  • klsm54
    replied
    One word of caution. Self Shielded, flux-cored wires, the ones used with NO gas, are very susceptible to changes in procedures. This means arc and voltage changes and electrode stick-out changes. In general, they have a very small window for their parameters, compared to either dual shield, or solid wires. So if you need to use these wires, do so after consulting the manufacturers recommended setting and procedures.

    The ER71T-GS wires, that are most readily available for smaller machines in .030 and .035 diameters, are lacking in mechanical properties when compared to most every other mild steel filler metal. They are not approved by any of the major auto manufactuerers for any stressed welding, including body panels. The ER71T-11, which is available in small diameters from some manufacturers, does offer an improvement, but still is not as good mechanically as gas shielded solid wire.

    The true realm of self shielded wires, at least wires with good mechanical properties needed for critical welds is in much larger diameters designed to be run at high amps and voltages, pretty much from large 3 phase machines or large engine driven power sources.

    Before the hate mail starts, there is a place for these small diameter wires. They are handy for the simple repairs that need to be done outside, where cover gas is hard to use. It is important to know their limitations before using them for any critical welding application though.

    There seems to be a growing misconception that by putting a flux cored wire in a small 135 to 180 amp that the machine will be magically transformed into a machine capable of welding much thicker materials. This is just not the case. Yes, a little thicker, but still, one needs to be aware of the mechanical properties and not expect too much from these small diameter wires.

    Flux cored wires, both self shielded and dual shield, have their place, as do all filler metals. But the proper equipment is always a precursor to producing quality welds. There is no magic wire that transforms any machine into something more than it was designed for. Sorry for the rant...

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  • HAWK
    Senior Member

  • HAWK
    replied
    pj,

    I have tried it both ways and usually run it like flux cored. Some brands burn better on DCSP and others on DCRP. It kinda reminds me of a 7014 rod that should burn DCSP, but some brands do better on DCRP.

    The last time I had so many problems I ended up on DCSP and using a 95%argon/5%O2 shield. This was the only way to cure the spatter and get a good bead profile. If you get a convex bead, then swap polarity.

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  • Paul Seaman
    Senior Member

  • Paul Seaman
    replied
    Hawk,
    I know that flux core runs straight polarity, which polarity do you use with the dual shield? I don't have any plans to do so but you never know when the tidbit of knowledge might be necessary.

    Thanks for all you do,

    Leave a comment:

  • HAWK
    Senior Member

  • HAWK
    replied
    BradJacob,

    Try a small spool of flux cored wire (E71T-11) and I think you go right back to gas shielded wire (ER70S-3,4,6) for shop work. Let's sweeten the pot. E71T-1 dual shield is a flux cored wire that requires additional shielding provided by 100% CO2 or 75%argon/25%CO2. The advantages are a very flat bead profile, excellent penetration,easy to run out of position, and a premium quality weld. It can be hard to run, fvrustrating to work with, tremendous flux mess to clean up/but chips away easily, smokier than plain flux cored.

    Leave a comment:

  • Glenn B
    Senior Member

  • Glenn B
    replied
    Flux core Pros: Can run outdoors with less problems, Burns hotter due to reversed polarity, Will weld ok on crustier stock due to flux action, Higher initial cost but when you add in gas costs its cheaper than solid wire.
    Flux core Cons: More Spatter, More clean up, More smoke & fumes, Clogs up liners faster, Hard to weld thin stock due to hotter weld,

    Solid wire Pros: Cleaner weld, Less Clean up, almost no smoke and spatter with C-25, welds cooler on sheet metal, You can see your puddle better What ya see is what ya got "no suprises when chipping off flux", use less contact tips.

    Solid wire cons: Need more gas when welding outside if breezy,If you run out of gas it's time for a cold one, "hope it's not after 4:00 on a saturday". You can get wire at home depot but not gas.

    Leave a comment:

  • fun4now
    Senior Member

  • fun4now
    replied
    short version

    fluxed core pros.
    is good for outside work and is better on rusty or dirty material.also gets a litle beter penitration i believe.

    cons. need cleaned up (chip off the slag).creates a lot of smoke making it harder to see youre weld puddle.defenetly not good indores. $$ is hier on fluxed

    non fluxed wire pros.
    almost no smoke easer to see weld puddle.great indors cleaner welds almost no cleanup needed. nicer aperance. a little cheaper even with the gass price.

    cons.
    cant realy use outdores (wind will blow away youre shielding gass)


    i am a fan of gass but have a 2lbs. spool of flux on the cart just incase

    Leave a comment:

  • BradJacob
    Member

  • BradJacob
    started a topic Flux Core -VS- Shielding Gas

    Flux Core -VS- Shielding Gas

    Being very new to welding, I have a ton of questions. So could anyone explain the differences (pros & cons) between Gas & Flux Core. Also, one thing I noticed: When welding with Flux-core, the sound is raspy. And when watching someone weld (on TV) with gas, the sound is "smoother" or like the sound is going through a paper towel cardboard tube (if you understand what I'm talkin about). Are there sound differences between these two types of processes?
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