Electric Gas Valve

[Paul Seaman]

Andy:
I have on occasion started to weld and forgotten to turn on the gas and today I did it again. That stupidity was a revelation, On NOS tanks for street they make an electric solonoid valve to turn on the flow of gas. How about suggesting such an animal for the wire feeders and attach it to the main power switch.

I just hate making mistakes, and that would be a new accessory to offer, shops that weld infrequently would appreciate this as one less thing to turn off at night.

This may have other consequences that I've not thought of but you can pass it on or forget it. If it works, I'll buy the first one, how is that for marketing, sell one to the guy who suggested it!!!

Peace,

[HAWK]

pj,


ASCO makes a number of high pressure gas rated solenoid valves. It would not be too hard to set up a system like you want. Here's one way: Use a normally closed 120VAC solenoid valve rated for the pressure and gas mix you are using, for example 75%Ar/25%CO2 @ 2500PSI, and a 60 amp 3 phase fused disconnect box. Wire the box for single phase 240VAC with 2 hots, a neutral, and ground. Pull the 240VAC from the ground and 2 hots for your welder. Pull 120VAC to power the gas solenoid from the ground, neutral and (1) hot wire. Hook your gas cylinder line into the solenoid valve on the incoming side and your regulator on the outgoing side, turn the gas on and test for leaks with the valve powered off. When you are ready to weld simply throw the disconnect switch on and you will have 240VAC to the welder and 120VAC to the solenoid valve simultaneously. If you are unable to locate such a pressure rated valve, use a lower rated valve and insert into the gas circuit after the regulator. Now you won't have to worry about turning your gas on except when you get a new bottle. H80N and I were recently discussing using a series of such valves with a PWM feedback to mix helium and argon in varying mix percentages for aluminum welding. I accept no responsibility for the use or accuracy of the information contained herein. Design and wiring of such circuits should be left to qualified individuals.

[HAWK]

pj,

From experience most all regulators and flowmeters exhibit a small amount of leak down. It would be best, in the interest of conserving gas, to use the high pressure rated valve and connect the regulator or flowmeter to the valve output. That's a good idea and I will probably hook one up next week just to see how it works.

[Paul Seaman]

HAWK:
I was thinking more on the line of pre-regulator and post shut off valve, and a factory set of connections so it is part of the overall package.

Also for the higher end digital controlled machines they could build a digitally controlled flow meter, so that on a given computerized control you would get the exact pressure and flow from each gas into the machine or manifold for mixing. So changing from Al to SS would be change the tungsten, program and fire it up. A setup like this would make exotic mixes obsolete, just program the pressure and flow by the percentages and this would give the operator more adjustability on the fly.

Just a thought,

[HAWK]

pj,

Good idea and probably exists as a separate control panel, but not in everday GP welding applications! I was just hitting along the lines of your statement "forgotten to turn the gas on today". Yes that is an external method, but very easy to wire up and useful none the less.

Actually with the Dynasty you would not have to change the tungsten unless it was a diameter change. The machine really likes 1.5% lanthanated for all around AC/DC welding.

[timw]

Rube Goldberg would be proud of you guys. I personally wouldn't want to leave the bottle turned on. Next thing you know you will forget to turn off the Oxy/Act bottles and a leak there is dangerous. Turning bottles off is a good habit to get into. I've learned to check them when ever I pass by, I even check them in other peoples shop, I will mention that they are on if I find them. I had the regulator fail that came with my MM 210. I turned the bottle on and tried to weld and I had no gas. I checked the bottle and the low side gage was pinned. I put on a flow meter that I had and was back in the game. The over pressure must have jammed the gas valve because I got no gas with the high pressure.

[HAWK]

timw,

I have always turned my bottles off when leaving the shop or finishing a road job. If I do hook up the valve it will be just to play and test. I could not sleep if I left any gas bottles turned.

[HAWK]

timw,

I was not ignoring your Rube Goldberg comment. I just rolled out of the bed on a very lazy rainy Sunday morning. The coffee is still brewing. You are correct. That is a very hard way to go about the easy task of turning on a bottle. As Rube much anticipated I too sometimes prefer the hard way to accomplish a task. Why? Human nature. I think it's the thought that it can be done with such an imaginative "invention".

[Paul Seaman]

I do agree about the OAW fuel gasses but the system I've seen for nitrous oxide would be convienient and I would hate to have a leak and lose expensive gas or ruin a regulator by leaving pressure on it so I will probably still turn off the bottles. Rube was a nut not average typical and normal like me, humble too ,
Peace

[HAWK]

pj,

Even though most of my welding gases are inert I would still rather have the bottle cylinder valves off when not in use. You have a good idea in the on/off mix, etc., and I'd like to have access to such. I am sure I would still crank the tank valves to the off position when I finished.

[ASKANDY]

PJS,

To put it simply, the cost would not be justified to add your gas feature to the product directly. It may work as an add-on or option but in this price competetive market, it would price us out of the ballpark compaired to our competitors. Most people wouldn't want to pay the extra money for a little convenience.
Good idea though.

A-

[hankj]

Another thought:

Use a low-pressure, low-voltage SPST switch on the discharge side of the flowmeter. Hook up an alarm lamp and mount it near your shop/garage door. Run some bell wire to a door-bell type trnasformer mounted conveniently, throught the swithch to the lamp, and Viola! - can't leave with the light on!!

Be well.

hankj

[ASKANDY]

Yea, but can you make it do my laundry and fix me breakfast too

[hankj]

Nah. You gotta have a Kenbeam (or is it Sunmore?) for that.

Be well.

hankj

[H80N]

Guys
what Hawk and I discussed were high frequency pwm computer controlled proportioning solenoid valves to make optimized argon / helium gas mixes for tig-ing aluminum and other non ferrous metals.. in this case you guys have heard my rant before about letting the machine take control of the man/machine interface.... simplest answer... is to turn off the tank valve before you leave the shop for the evening... cost Zero.. result Priceless........ (kissing your honey as you roll into bed.. will also help your longtime happiness... no computer required)
Heiti