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  • Millermatic 200 / Maxstar 90 question

    Well since I burned my BIG welder up I now am going to resort back to the old Millermatic for now. It is a Millermatic 200 with the SK-35 spot weld panel. I know that the machine is rated at 200/230 but what will it really do? Are there any limitations that I should know about? I got this welder with a roll of wire and a full tank for a steal in 2011 as a back up. I have used it to weld small stuff on occasion, but what are my limits with this? I know there is a good following for these older Millers, and I have read the forums but does anyone have any suggestions/input? I am working on a project that requires a 3/8 wall tube to be welded to a 3/4" plate. It is the white face design.The S/N:JB548181Also I have a Maxstar 90 with the snap start box. I need a plasma and I am thinking of offering this up in trade plus some cash. What is this worth? It is in good shape, just some light rust from sitting in the garage. It works fine, I use it as a travel TIG when I have to go help out a friend, or do a small job for someone.Welder S/N: KC187518HF Snap Start S/N: KC210260

  • #2
    Originally posted by SShep71 View Post
    Well since I burned my BIG welder up I now am going to resort back to the old Millermatic for now. It is a Millermatic 200 with the SK-35 spot weld panel. I know that the machine is rated at 200/230 but what will it really do? Are there any limitations that I should know about? I got this welder with a roll of wire and a full tank for a steal in 2011 as a back up. I have used it to weld small stuff on occasion, but what are my limits with this? I know there is a good following for these older Millers, and I have read the forums but does anyone have any suggestions/input? I am working on a project that requires a 3/8 wall tube to be welded to a 3/4" plate. It is the white face design.The S/N:JB548181Also I have a Maxstar 90 with the snap start box. I need a plasma and I am thinking of offering this up in trade plus some cash. What is this worth? It is in good shape, just some light rust from sitting in the garage. It works fine, I use it as a travel TIG when I have to go help out a friend, or do a small job for someone.Welder S/N: KC187518HF Snap Start S/N: KC210260
    You have a gem...

    The MM200 has specs and duty cycle nearly identical to the current MM252...

    270 Amps @ 35% dury cycle....

    http://www.millerwelds.com/om/o1303p_mil.pdf
    .

    *******************************************
    The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

    “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

    Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

    My Blue Stuff:
    Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
    Dynasty 200DX
    Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
    Millermatic 200

    TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for the quick feedback, that output is actually better than what I expected. I know I am still not at the 300 amps that I need for this weld to be proper, but I know I can do a good amount more than I thought before. I guess I have to keep looking around, for a replacement.

      Comment


      • #4
        I you cant weld a piece of 3/8" with a MM200, then you are doing something wrong. If you dont like short arc, then get a bottle of spray gas and spray arc the thing.

        Comment


        • #5
          Millermatic 200 / Maxstar 90 question

          Pre heat the 3/4" then weld away. Should not be a problem

          Comment


          • #6
            I was thinking spray would be the way to go, but i just don't know if this machine would do it for this one time part. I am looking at running dual shield wire with it when I get to the welding part of this. I know that the voltage is there I just dont know if the amperage is there. One of the guys suggested that I run my S32p (voltage sensing) wire feeder with my AIRCO 300amp Heliarc TIG/stick machine. I never had to deal with a setup like that before and I question as if it will work. I know that the requirement for CC is a problem, but what is the right answer here?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by SShep71 View Post
              I was thinking spray would be the way to go, but i just don't know if this machine would do it for this one time part. I am looking at running dual shield wire with it when I get to the welding part of this. I know that the voltage is there I just dont know if the amperage is there. One of the guys suggested that I run my S32p (voltage sensing) wire feeder with my AIRCO 300amp Heliarc TIG/stick machine. I never had to deal with a setup like that before and I question as if it will work. I know that the requirement for CC is a problem, but what is the right answer here?
              Why not just spray with the MM200.. ?? it has the grunt to do it..

              here is a thread on it...


              http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...ht=mm200+spray

              know several folks running 90/10 with good results..

              http://www.millerwelds.com/resources...ht=mm200+spray

              there are a few more if you do a search...
              Last edited by H80N; 12-05-2014, 12:44 PM.
              .

              *******************************************
              The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

              “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

              Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

              My Blue Stuff:
              Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
              Dynasty 200DX
              Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
              Millermatic 200

              TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

              Comment


              • #8
                Millermatic 200 / Maxstar 90 question

                H80N is right. That Michine will easy spray arc.
                I use 85-15, or 90-10 will let you go into spray at lower voltage & amps.
                045 dual shield will work fine
                Pre heat 3/4 will also give you penetration and better start.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Well I finally got some time this past week to get behind a shield and try out a test coupon, I cannot get this machine to reach "spray". I have a 5" x 8" x 3/4" plate with a 5" x 8" x 3/8" plate tacked at 90deg for a T joint. I did not grind a bevel, just fit-up, ground mill scale and tacked in place. I have my machine set on highest/ #6 detent, with the WFS up almost as high as it will go, the gun and the ground are the shortest length I had in the shop. I am running ER70-s2 .035 with 90/10 , and also ER70C-6M .045 with 90/10. The machine is in DCRP with the burnback at 50%, and still no spray, just short circuit. The machine itself is at 220v with a 60amp breaker and #8 wire feeding it. I am going to have to test the voltage/amperage output with a meter as soon as I can get my hands on one. I welded the plate from the middle out with push and then the middle out with pull, both on the same side with the .035 wire, and repeated the middle out push/pull with the .045 wire on the opposite side. I then saw cut the plate, polished and acid etched to check the weld deposition/penetration and there is little if any penetration past the vertical edge of the 3/8" plate. This is NOT going to work for the weld strength I need to achieve on the base plate. Does anyone have any suggestions?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There is no burn back functions on a MM200, therefore you do not have one. And true spray gas is 98/2

                    Besides burn back has zero to do with how a machine welds, merely there for a robotic application so the wire can't burn back to the tip.
                    Last edited by cruizer; 12-16-2014, 04:39 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Cruizer, Thank you for your opinion, but if you read the thread's first/initial post, the welder has the SK-35 spot weld panel with the spot timer, and the burn back time control. This is described on page 25 of the PDF that (H80N) posted above. I invite you to read through it whenever you can find time as it is FULL of useful information. According to the miller personnel I talked to the burn back should be set at 50% when not using the spot feature, I do not know if this is relevant being as that the SK-35 panel looks as if it is bypassed when not switched on, but it can't hurt. I also do appreciate your opinion relative to the 98/2 gas, as I do know that there are SEVERAL different theories covering the different gas mixtures and their interaction with the deposition rate capabilities, heat transfer criteria and the atomization of the filler metal relative to the base metal. I have however, used 90/10 mix on many occasions with the spray transfer process with nothing bad to say. It is actually the recommended gas mixture per the wire that I am using. The burn back is used to determine the energization of the weld wire in reference to the welding process stopping. You are partially right as it does not effect the machine in how it welds, but it is not "merely there for a robotic application". Thank you again for your opinion, and I can assure you that I do in fact have a MM200.That being said, is there anyone out there with any real input related to the actual topic?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        On a hunch I went over to the shop today and 15 min later the machine was doing spray, with 90/10 gas, ER70-s6 .035, and the machine set on detent #6. The problem was that the machine has a bar to switch between 200v and 230v input power. I went over to the shop and tested the lugs to make sure that I was within the allowable percentages of the listed input power and I was too far below the 230v input. The machine was set with the link bar at 230V. I just took the case off, switched the link bar, plugged the machine back in, and turned it on with the multimeter to monitor the input power at the machine. Everything checked out fine so I tried a out a bead, and what a difference there was in the weld from the previous setting. I adjusted the wire speed down, a few times to fine tune the wire speed and now it lays down a hot, flat smooth bead. After I get back from my trip home in the new year I will make up some test coupons and see what the penetration looks like. So current settings, Spray-arc with my 1981 Millermatic 200 (S/N: JB548181), with 208/120 power at the breaker panel, 60 amp breaker with #8 wire to receptacle, 210 volt input at the machine, and the tie bar set at 200v.--Voltage detent #6 (machine set to use high side of output voltage)-WFS set at 65 (machine setting, not true fpm)-90/10 argon/CO2 24 CFM (appx)-ER 70s-6 .035 wire-DCRP (electrode positive)-3/4" wire stick out-1/8" - 3/16" recessed tip-bare steel (no mill scale)-Pushing the puddleI will post updates when I get back to see what the actual penetration/deposition cross section looks like after cut and acid etch. The target is 3/8" wall tube welded to 3/4" plate.
                        Last edited by SShep71; 12-16-2014, 02:47 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          They do seem to perform better when they are set up for the proper voltage...

                          Generally a really good idea to check those settings before you connect them to power...

                          helps to keep the smoke from getting out..

                          Glad you got it sorted out without major malfunction...
                          .

                          *******************************************
                          The more you know, The better you know, How little you know

                          “The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten”

                          Buy the best tools you can afford.. Learn to use them to the best of your ability.. and take care of them...

                          My Blue Stuff:
                          Dynasty 350DX Tigrunner
                          Dynasty 200DX
                          Millermatic 350P w/25ft Alumapro & 30A
                          Millermatic 200

                          TONS of Non-Blue Equip, plus CNC Mill, Lathes & a Plasmacam w/ PowerMax-1000

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Burn back is for "End of weld" applications. pretty tough to use unless your a Hudderite or a Robot. as the wire stops and the contactor is left on for a time frame, and the wire burns back. So the gun is held very stationary. This is so the wire doesn't stick to the work

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              H80N: I knew that the link bar was on the 230 setting as I had set it there when I wired it in at my last shop. I just didn't check the actual voltage at the breaker box and receptacle. I knew I was under the 230v with my power that is the reason I didn't check first, this was all (supposed to be) just a simple test. Lesson learned "check actual line voltage, and lug voltage". Now the big question is going to be how does it do with the target thickness? I will post updates when I get back. ---Cruizer: I believe I was considerate in the first response to your "opinion" in the hopes that I could dispel the blatant nonsense you posted. I will now be straight forward with you in this response when I tell you that you don't know what you are talking about. If you did you would know that in spot/stitch welding there is a use for burnback. Similar to the "stationary gun, machine gun" system to which you refer to as robotic welding. The on/off cycling of a welder under spot / stitch settings when done under certain conditions can result in the wire advancing after the relay for main power switches off. The power to the wire breaks however the motor under the effects of all those pesky "physics" can/will advance (rotate) even in small as .10ths of a second of rotation, or advance in large visually measurable minutes or even degrees of rotation. Where as it is a possibility that YOU cannot hold an arc length, standoff, or maintain a gun position in all three axis consistently, there are many people out there who can. A second reason that one can use the burn back would be in the instance of accuracy for weld spot starting, the starting point for the wire in the Z axis relative to the starting time and ending time for the wire feed/ wire hot of spotting would depend on the wire starting in the same exact position each time. The last reason that I can remember off the top of my head from what I have learned about the process settings, is the way the hot bud on the end of the MIG wire will remain shielded in gas after the current/voltage switches off without the need for the bud to be clipped off in between each start/stop cycle. So Cruizer, instead of making this a back and forth MIG pissing contest about who knows more, why don't you just cowboy up admit that you were wrong and go waste everyone's time on a different thread or Facebook... or...how about you just let it go and move along, this is just more nonsense that some poor sap will have to read through in the search for answers to their questions when searching fr specific info.
                              Last edited by SShep71; 12-17-2014, 04:41 AM.

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