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  • Question on welding cables and HF

    Ok, I have been getting HLP-1 errors and have a new PC1 board ordered but after continuous reading online so it doesn't happen again (if that fixes it), I came across some warnings about cables hanging on handles being a big NO NO. So, being that I have my cables hanging or looped a few turns on the the handles on the front of my Syncrowave 250DX as it is next to my welding bench, could that cause the HLP-1 error or could that have somehow ruined my PC1 board? I have the stock 25ft cables with a WP20 torch (water cooled) and want to be sure I need to unwrap my cables in the future every time I use my welder, or maybe only when welding aluminum in continuous HF mode. I was talking to tech support but I kept getting disconnected because of lousy cell phone service so I figured I should get more opinions here.
    Thanks in advance,
    Grumple
    Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
    Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
    Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

  • #2
    Originally posted by Grumple View Post
    Ok, I have been getting HLP-1 errors and have a new PC1 board ordered but after continuous reading online so it doesn't happen again (if that fixes it), I came across some warnings about cables hanging on handles being a big NO NO. So, being that I have my cables hanging or looped a few turns on the the handles on the front of my Syncrowave 250DX as it is next to my welding bench, could that cause the HLP-1 error or could that have somehow ruined my PC1 board? I have the stock 25ft cables with a WP20 torch (water cooled) and want to be sure I need to unwrap my cables in the future every time I use my welder, or maybe only when welding aluminum in continuous HF mode. I was talking to tech support but I kept getting disconnected because of lousy cell phone service so I figured I should get more opinions here.
    Thanks in advance,
    Grumple
    Cruizer has posted several times that the best way to eliminate RFI induced by welder HF is to tie the output and work cables together so that they are parallel and close for the first couple of feet...
    It is GOOD advice..
    .

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    • #3
      Possible but unlikely. A board failure merely happens. Components especially worn capacitors are generally the faults, and over load other items.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by H80N View Post
        Cruizer has posted several times that the best way to eliminate RFI induced by welder HF is to tie the output and work cables together so that they are parallel and close for the first couple of feet...
        It is GOOD advice..
        Do you mean at the machine end take the tig torch cable and ground cable and run them together and tie wrap with some nylon ties? Just for 2 - 3 feet? Sounds easy enough.
        Thanks,
        Grunple
        Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
        Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
        Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by cruizer View Post
          Possible but unlikely. A board failure merely happens. Components especially worn capacitors are generally the faults, and over load other items.
          Thanks cruizer,
          I would hate to think having my cables looped over the handles to keep them from getting dirty and stepped on would have hurt my machine, but it is also good to know that it is possible. I will mop the shop floor and let it dry before I unwind my cables for AC welding anyhow...
          Grumple
          Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
          Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
          Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

          Comment


          • #6
            A lot of myths out there in welding land. I kinda research all of them. besides your shop could be anckle deep in welding garbage, and all you'd do to clear the HF interference is tywrap the first 2' of the work and torch together. Presto, no more hf going everwhere.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by cruizer View Post
              A lot of myths out there in welding land. I kinda research all of them. besides your shop could be anckle deep in welding garbage, and all you'd do to clear the HF interference is tywrap the first 2' of the work and torch together. Presto, no more hf going everwhere.
              My shop is pretty clean as I keep it that way and, I will surely try your idea or method but please make it clear that the first 2 feet are tie-wrapped at the front of the machine and not at the torch end. I am sure that is what you mean as it would be impossible to do the other but I have been known to misunderstand things before.
              Thanks,
              Grumple

              p.s. It was suggested to unplug the stinger cable if I am not using it too. Make sense?

              p.s. I found this thread elsewhere that mentions tie-wrapping the leads 3 feet from the machine end so I got that sorted. Thanks.
              http://www.hobartwelders.com/weldtal...p/t-28685.html
              Last edited by Grumple; 10-31-2014, 02:31 PM.
              Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
              Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
              Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

              Comment


              • #8
                That doesn't make much sence either as there is no circuit completion with the stinger, unless its wrapped up while using it.. also don't want your tig torch wrapped on the machine while using it, cause that kinda makes a transformer/magnetics.

                As for tywrapping, what we are doing is making a mini transmission tower. Positive is always looking for negative, and HF is the same way in ac or dc. If we can eliminate the HF from Hunting, all the better and as another plus, the arc is significantly more focused. Pretty simple solution for a complicated matter.

                And its the first 2 feet after leaving the machine seems to be the trick.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by cruizer View Post
                  That doesn't make much sence either as there is no circuit completion with the stinger, unless its wrapped up while using it.. also don't want your tig torch wrapped on the machine while using it, cause that kinda makes a transformer/magnetics.

                  As for tywrapping, what we are doing is making a mini transmission tower. Positive is always looking for negative, and HF is the same way in ac or dc. If we can eliminate the HF from Hunting, all the better and as another plus, the arc is significantly more focused. Pretty simple solution for a complicated matter.

                  And its the first 2 feet after leaving the machine seems to be the trick.
                  Ok, that clears things up and I guess along with that, unwrap the two loops of my tig torch from the handles when in use and I will be golden.
                  Thanks,
                  Grumple
                  Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
                  Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
                  Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Grumple View Post
                    Thanks cruizer,
                    I would hate to think having my cables looped over the handles to keep them from getting dirty and stepped on would have hurt my machine, but it is also good to know that it is possible. I will mop the shop floor and let it dry before I unwind my cables for AC welding anyhow...
                    Grumple
                    Don't loop any live cables over the handles of the machine.
                    EXPERIENCE TALKING.

                    Griff
                    Last edited by griff01; 11-01-2014, 08:01 AM. Reason: add

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by griff01 View Post
                      Don't loop any live cables over the handles of the machine.
                      EXPERIENCE TALKING.

                      Griff
                      Griff,
                      What was your experience? Hurt the machine, or hurt the operator?
                      Thanks,
                      Grumple
                      Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
                      Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
                      Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Grumple View Post
                        Griff,
                        What was your experience? Hurt the machine, or hurt the operator?
                        Thanks,
                        Grumple
                        Its a long story but the short of it is that with the stick lead hooked up and wrapped around the handles on the front of the machine and then trying to TIG, the arc would go crazy. Could not even begin to establish a puddle.
                        I could set the stick lead on the floor and the TIG operation would be fine.

                        This would repeat exactly every time. A couple of months later the main pc board went out.

                        This was with an older machine before the dinse connectors.

                        Griff

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by griff01 View Post
                          Its a long story but the short of it is that with the stick lead hooked up and wrapped around the handles on the front of the machine and then trying to TIG, the arc would go crazy. Could not even begin to establish a puddle.
                          I could set the stick lead on the floor and the TIG operation would be fine.

                          This would repeat exactly every time. A couple of months later the main pc board went out.

                          This was with an older machine before the dinse connectors.

                          Griff
                          Thanks for the info Griff. I hate when stuff like that happens.
                          Grumple
                          Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
                          Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
                          Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Grumple View Post
                            Thanks for the info Griff. I hate when stuff like that happens.
                            Grumple
                            Miller warranteed the board and I quit hanging cables on the handles.
                            No problems since.

                            Griff

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by griff01 View Post
                              Miller warranteed the board and I quit hanging cables on the handles.
                              No problems since.

                              Griff
                              I am still not sure what caused my HLP-1 errors but I bought my Syncrowave 250DX Runner in 2008 and have welded as much as a hobbyist welds (low hours, DCEN) and I went to weld some aluminum and that is when I got the errors with no changes to the machine (cables with 2 loops around the handles) except the HF turned on to continuous and the main contactor to AC and the troubles began. That is why I am still trying to get my ground and table setup questions cleared up as my PC1 board is the $862 retail one that I found for $698 from R&M Welding (Miller4Less). I don't know if the tig cable wraps around the handles or the table pushed up against the steel building and galvanized sheet to protect the insulation caused the problem, but I sure don't want to take out the board if my setup caused it. I want my new board to be the last one I have to put in.
                              Oxy/Ac Large Tanks
                              Miller Swinger AC 180 (SOLD)
                              Miller Syncrowave 250DX Runner with Pulser

                              Comment

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