Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Please help anyone who knows what e6010 is suppose to look like

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by Rig Hand View Post
    Well it ain't pretty but, its something. horizontal fillet, 5/32 6010, Invertec 350 @ about 125 amps. I might have to fire up the SA-250 to redeem myself
    Dont bother, thats a thing of beauty!!

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Rig Hand View Post
      Donald,

      I mean no disrespect but, I have burned probably a ton of 6010 and 8010 in the last few years. About 90% of that rod was burnt on x-ray pipe welds the rest was on thread-o-lets. I probably whipped a few caps on the T.O.L. but everything else was a drag or side to side motion. All of the reasons for whipping that people have listed are mind blowing. I'm no golden arm but, I've burnt a pound or two of stick rod. Most of which was out of position and not under the most ideal conditions. So I'll say it again, I don't understand why everyone "whips" there xx10 rods. These rods run just fine at a nice steady drag. Unless a couple thousand pieces of x-ray film and a dozen welding inspectors are wrong.

      Just my thoughts.

      This is the truth right here.
      It's (as I've said 3,974 times) it's a big broad welding world out there.
      Some guys have burnt a few cellulose rods (6010, 7010, 8010), some guys who live in my little sliver of that welding world, burn them day in and day out where on a hooked up day a welder goes thru a 50 lb can per day. Week after week and month after month.
      The first bunch (those who burn a few) seem to always tell you you "have" to step (or whip if you like the word) those rods.
      The second bunch will overwhealmingly tell you that the conditions of the joint will almost always allow you to "not" step the rod, but that there are some circumstances where you will want to. Those circumstances are usually not ideal. In an ideal world most (but not all) welders who make day in and day out code quality welds with cellulose rods will never step anything, 'cept a hot pass. A small few will step every pass.
      And, people who tell you that cellulistic rods are a "low deposition" consumable have never been in a salty firing line. Or never put the stopwatch to a series of hardass downhill production welds on a regular basis.
      They've only read about it. Watch carefully the advise given by people who "only read about it" in place of making a living "doing it".
      Learning these rods is a starting point for most students, and they will usually move on to running LoHi or hard wire or a flux core wire but a few people will make their living in pipe rod land (cellusose rod). To the first group it doesn't really matter but the (small) later group they really need to learn the rods.
      '10 rods can (and are every day) be run as pretty as any LoHi, ridiculosly close ripples, heavy deposit and all. It's just not normally seen in the regular welding segments of that "big broad" welding universe where most folks work.
      I can teach my 9 year old Daughter to run a slick LoHi fillet weld in about 2 hours. Getting her up to snuff with a '10 rod will take quite a bit longer. LoHi makes it's own ripples, that's why people love it. With 6010 (or 7010 or 8010) YOU make the ripple each and every one the rod does no work for you, every tiny wobble and bobble shows, solidified in steel forever. That is in my opinion why most programs start welding students on 6010 type rods.
      But that's probably not a good idea for people who'll never burn a 6010 in anger. Start them on what they'll use in the workplace and avoid all the hassle of (sorta, poorly) learning a rod they'll never use, that time is wasted time.
      The future Pipeliners of the world, start em out right, welding pipe with downhill pipe rods.
      But the 60, 70, 8010 rods are run every day on pipe and plate with no steppin-a-goin on, making really purty welds, fastly, so don't tell us that 6010 "has" to be stepped.
      All my take so take it or junk it.

      JT
      Some days you eat the bear. And some days the bear eats you.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by JTMcC View Post
        This is the truth right here.
        It's (as I've said 3,974 times) it's a big broad welding world out there.
        Some guys have burnt a few cellulose rods (6010, 7010, 8010), some guys who live in my little sliver of that welding world, burn them day in and day out where on a hooked up day a welder goes thru a 50 lb can per day. Week after week and month after month.
        The first bunch (those who burn a few) seem to always tell you you "have" to step (or whip if you like the word) those rods.
        The second bunch will overwhealmingly tell you that the conditions of the joint will almost always allow you to "not" step the rod, but that there are some circumstances where you will want to. Those circumstances are usually not ideal. In an ideal world most (but not all) welders who make day in and day out code quality welds with cellulose rods will never step anything, 'cept a hot pass. A small few will step every pass.
        And, people who tell you that cellulistic rods are a "low deposition" consumable have never been in a salty firing line. Or never put the stopwatch to a series of hardass downhill production welds on a regular basis.
        They've only read about it. Watch carefully the advise given by people who "only read about it" in place of making a living "doing it".
        Learning these rods is a starting point for most students, and they will usually move on to running LoHi or hard wire or a flux core wire but a few people will make their living in pipe rod land (cellusose rod). To the first group it doesn't really matter but the (small) later group they really need to learn the rods.
        '10 rods can (and are every day) be run as pretty as any LoHi, ridiculosly close ripples, heavy deposit and all. It's just not normally seen in the regular welding segments of that "big broad" welding universe where most folks work.
        I can teach my 9 year old Daughter to run a slick LoHi fillet weld in about 2 hours. Getting her up to snuff with a '10 rod will take quite a bit longer. LoHi makes it's own ripples, that's why people love it. With 6010 (or 7010 or 8010) YOU make the ripple each and every one the rod does no work for you, every tiny wobble and bobble shows, solidified in steel forever. That is in my opinion why most programs start welding students on 6010 type rods.
        But that's probably not a good idea for people who'll never burn a 6010 in anger. Start them on what they'll use in the workplace and avoid all the hassle of (sorta, poorly) learning a rod they'll never use, that time is wasted time.
        The future Pipeliners of the world, start em out right, welding pipe with downhill pipe rods.
        But the 60, 70, 8010 rods are run every day on pipe and plate with no steppin-a-goin on, making really purty welds, fastly, so don't tell us that 6010 "has" to be stepped.
        All my take so take it or junk it.

        JT
        and you call me the dumbazz
        thank you jt
        Daniel
        someone please tell me I'm wrong

        Comment


        • #34
          you only have to step it when your too hot and 125 amps is way too hot for 1/8" 6010
          Daniel
          someone please tell me I'm wrong

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Cornerstone View Post
            Dont bother, thats a thing of beauty!!
            Thanks but, I can do a lot better. I haven't really found a "sweet stop" with this invertec. It seem to run "wet" and 6010 doesn't freeze up like 70+ but, I tried.

            How you been Cornerstone? Thawed out yet?
            '08 F-350
            Vantage 400
            SA-250
            SA-200
            Invertec V350Pro
            Invertec V205T-AC/DC

            Miller 12VS suitcase
            Miller spectrum 2050

            Pipe beveler's
            Track torch

            Comment


            • #36
              I can really tell improvement if I get a chance to weld once in a while, this is not a poster weld either but to give idea. Overhead fillet. This winter maybe I get some pics after I been welding a week somewhere. For me it makes a big difference in consistency, I can even tell improvement in a couple rods.
              Attached Files

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Rig Hand View Post
                Thanks but, I can do a lot better. I haven't really found a "sweet stop" with this invertec. It seem to run "wet" and 6010 doesn't freeze up like 70+ but, I tried.

                How you been Cornerstone? Thawed out yet?
                Finally! Its been so long, 65degrees today. Pheww!

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by pwteng View Post
                  you only have to step it when your too hot and 125 amps is way too hot for 1/8" 6010

                  If you are referring to Rig Hand's post that was a 5/32" 6010. Also you siding with JTMcC is plain nonsense!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Excellent and informative post...

                    JTMcC

                    That was a very nice and informative post. I have mostly stayed out of this one 'til now and gladly so. You just covered it all! Good to hear from you every once in a while. One thought on small diameter pipe up or down :there ain't no time for stepping-just fetching.

                    HAWK

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Rig Hand View Post
                      Well it ain't pretty but, its something. horizontal fillet, 5/32 6010, Invertec 350 @ about 125 amps. I might have to fire up the SA-250 to redeem myself
                      showed my professor this and he said there are wagon tracks? is he just way to picky ? thanks so much for posting the pic thpough?

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by countryboy281 View Post
                        showed my professor this and he said there are wagon tracks? is he just way to picky ? thanks so much for posting the pic thpough?

                        I put my bifocals on and see some inconsistent spacing, but not slag inclusions on the toes-if that is what he's calling "wagon tracks"? I've run roots before with less than perfect visuals on the toes, all uphill root, (hot and fill -same pass on 1" in this case), cap with 6010 on 1" pipe 6G test and still passed the films. The x-rays show slag inclusions if any. See what I'm getting at here? If necessary, you can grind the root to clean it up before running your hot pass, fills, and cap.

                        I really don't see what your prof is up in the air about. I'd like to for him spend a week with me or Rig Hand or JTMcC's boys cranking out #40-#50 of cellulose rods a day. Some guys have cush-cush jobs and like to make things up to create a better image for themselves.

                        Maybe there is slag trapped along the toes, but I can't see it. Personally speaking Rig Hand did a fine job of showing you stepping a xx10 rod by example weld!

                        Have the teach throw out a "quicky" and let us evaluate his work. Yea. Right! Like that's goinna happen. Sorry-a little east Tennessee slang. I guess he's too busy criticizing other people's work-other people who do it for a living. It ain't no cush cush job I promise that my friend!

                        BTW: I mean no disrespect toward you sir. My irritation and resentment is aimed at your teacher.

                        My .02,

                        HAWK
                        Last edited by HAWK; 05-10-2011, 08:59 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          i dont see how any one can criticize the looks of a 10 0r 11 bead, no matter how hard we try, the results are cosmetically awful compared to the other more pleasing rods that we use. wagon tracks, i dont see it, i see a normal looking bead with that rod, not so pretty but thats how they look when done correctly

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by kevin View Post
                            i dont see how any one can criticize the looks of a 10 0r 11 bead, no matter how hard we try, the results are cosmetically awful compared to the other more pleasing rods that we use. wagon tracks, i dont see it, i see a normal looking bead with that rod, not so pretty but thats how they look when done correctly
                            Kevin,

                            That rod can be run to look **** near like a 7018 with a little lateral wrist action accompanying an otherwise smooth drag as already stated by JT and Rig Hand. Thanks for looking because I can't see any wagon tracks either. Yes, it's a clean example of a a xx10 root pass fillet weld. It looks normal for a "stepped" root pass and most roots are "stepped".

                            When I had to break in a new guy in the past I'd teach stepping the rod, then circular motion, then transition to pretty much a smooth drag. They get the hang of it in a few weeks. Now the 6G test requires quite a bit more hands on time.

                            I think the teacher has optical rectalitis-has his head up his assz!

                            Again my .02,

                            HAWK
                            Last edited by HAWK; 05-10-2011, 09:23 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Plate clamped to bench, standing up, bent over reaching under to do overhead, open with no bevel on 1/4.
                              Attached Files

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by countryboy281 View Post
                                showed my professor this and he said there are wagon tracks? is he just way to picky ? thanks so much for posting the pic thpough?
                                "Wagon tracks" are a defect that will really only show up on radiographic inspection, not a visual. It refers to small slag inclusions that usually run along the toes of the root bead (usually on pipe) and will generally be covered by several passes of weld. It's an interior weld defect, not a surface defect. They show up as two dark parallel spotty lines on X-ray film, hence the nickname "wagon tracks". Undercut and wagon tracks are not the same thing, and the terms are not interchangeable. (edit: Not that it matters, because there's no visible undercut in rig hand's pic either)

                                If your instructor can really see things in X-ray vision, tell him he's in the wrong business! I think in this case he just has his terms messed up.
                                Last edited by MR.57; 05-11-2011, 10:36 AM.
                                2007 Miller Dynasty 200 DX
                                2005 Miller Passport 180

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X