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Miller 212 sloppy/spitty starts

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  • Miller 212 sloppy/spitty starts

    Replaced my great working 210 for a 212. Was in the middle of a job and the 210 took a dump est time of repair was unexceptable so bought a 212. Back to shop figgering this is gittin' me out of the sh***er wrong. Cold spitty starts xtra cleanup changed wire increased gas flow to 35 same problem. Back to the shop/new startcard/back to shop/same problem, cost me 4 hrs ----put machine in corner used my Esab 250 to finish/now it's back in the shop''Keep It Til It Work's''.
    Any problems with 212's?

  • #2
    i had the same problem with my 252 till i got rid of the POS ground clamp and put a quality one on it. helped a lot. changed out the m25 gun for a Radnor pro 250 for more flex/comfort and if i run to long of a stick out it pop gun starts. it doesn't like more than 3/8". just 2 things to try. i use c25 @20 cf.
    Last edited by jbmprods; 02-08-2011, 09:12 PM.
    miller 225 bobcat
    miller aead200le (with miller hf tig trailer mounted)
    mm175, mm211, TA181i
    mm252 w/30a spool gun
    precision tig 225
    hobart stickmate LX ac/dc
    Speedglas 9100X & XX / Miller Digital Elite
    hypertherm 380 & cutmaster 52
    victor journeyman & super range
    ridgid chop saw, kalamazoo band saw
    steel max and evolution carbide saws
    6 4.5" & a 20lb 9" rockwell grinders
    case 580 backhoe (for what i can"t lift)
    if first you don't succeed
    trash the b#####d

    Comment


    • #3
      What size wire were you running...Bob
      Bob Wright

      Comment


      • #4
        Yep, like I've been mentioning on alot of threads, the problem has to do with the crappy ground clamps both Miller and Lincoln were/are still putting out. If the ground clamps has NO brass contacts and feels loose when you open the jaws. REPLACE it.

        Problems simply go away.

        Comment


        • #5
          Cruizer's ground clamp advice on an older thread helped with the same problem on my MM251. I also set the run-in to 80% and that seemed to clean it up. Much softer starts now. BTW If you're going to a brass ground clamp, the HF offering is actually pretty good quality. I took a copper lug from HF, cut off the lug part and gently crimped the lug sleeve to the cable before inserting it in the clamp and tightening the bolt. Works great.
          Lincoln AC/DC Buzz Box (where it all began)
          DialArc 250
          Syncrowave 180 SD
          MM 251

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by nedster View Post
            Cruizer's ground clamp advice on an older thread helped with the same problem on my MM251. I also set the run-in to 80% and that seemed to clean it up. Much softer starts now. BTW If you're going to a brass ground clamp, the HF offering is actually pretty good quality. I took a copper lug from HF, cut off the lug part and gently crimped the lug sleeve to the cable before inserting it in the clamp and tightening the bolt. Works great.
            thin wall copper tubing is what i use. i'll have try the run in. my 252 starts with a bang sometimes to the point it welds the wire to the tip. just a quick scratch to the metal while tapping the trigger melts it loose though and i'm good to go. thats the hardest thing i've had to get used to over my mm175. love the soft start it has.
            miller 225 bobcat
            miller aead200le (with miller hf tig trailer mounted)
            mm175, mm211, TA181i
            mm252 w/30a spool gun
            precision tig 225
            hobart stickmate LX ac/dc
            Speedglas 9100X & XX / Miller Digital Elite
            hypertherm 380 & cutmaster 52
            victor journeyman & super range
            ridgid chop saw, kalamazoo band saw
            steel max and evolution carbide saws
            6 4.5" & a 20lb 9" rockwell grinders
            case 580 backhoe (for what i can"t lift)
            if first you don't succeed
            trash the b#####d

            Comment


            • #7
              There is a warranty update for the 252.s where they incorporate a connector at RC8 as the exsisting connector does not make a secure enough contact. these are the power supply leads to run the board.

              I see its not listed as a service memo, though if any warranty is done on a 252, this lead is provided.

              Comment


              • #8
                It doesn't matter what size wire,my old 210 was a far superior machine. The grd clamp sounds like a good idea. I believe in the K.I.S.S principle.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by cruizer View Post
                  There is a warranty update for the 252.s where they incorporate a connector at RC8 as the exsisting connector does not make a secure enough contact. these are the power supply leads to run the board.

                  I see its not listed as a service memo, though if any warranty is done on a 252, this lead is provided.
                  thanks cruizer.
                  is this for all 252's or is there a prior ser.# where this update applies?
                  miller 225 bobcat
                  miller aead200le (with miller hf tig trailer mounted)
                  mm175, mm211, TA181i
                  mm252 w/30a spool gun
                  precision tig 225
                  hobart stickmate LX ac/dc
                  Speedglas 9100X & XX / Miller Digital Elite
                  hypertherm 380 & cutmaster 52
                  victor journeyman & super range
                  ridgid chop saw, kalamazoo band saw
                  steel max and evolution carbide saws
                  6 4.5" & a 20lb 9" rockwell grinders
                  case 580 backhoe (for what i can"t lift)
                  if first you don't succeed
                  trash the b#####d

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Not sure on the serial #, however, if you happen to open yours, on the bottom of the board, you'll either have a direct plugin with the copper wires attched to the molex receptacle (RC-8), or you'll have another harness attaching to the board and down to the auxillary connector. The latter would be the new one.

                    Miller may be adding this connecter on a case by case senario. however say if you had a machine comming off warranty, you should definately inquire about this update. You don't want a poofed board out of warranty for sure!
                    Last edited by cruizer; 02-10-2011, 04:08 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Back from the shop

                      Finally got my 212 back from the shop. It took two weeks for the Miller rep to get around to checking it. Sez' nothing wrong, I have too long of a standout WTF? I've only been welding for 40 years, I think I've learned a few things. I'm going to try the ground clamp advise,''Thank's Cruizer'', if that don't work Miller is getting a welder back.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Well thats actually likely, as most shops, even myself don't actually test weld with the machine. We load bank and scope the machine and if everything is cool we release it. Mind you, we hook up direct to the output studs for testing.

                        I had a series of problems with the Miller and Lincoln lineup having to do with the resistance problems with the inferior ground clamps as most of the board controlled machines had to sense arc resistance. So I grabed a customers machine, in this case a Lincoln, tore it down, and checked everything, scoped it, and welded with it, started to go insane, I said F' it and changed the factory ground clamp out, presto the machine came alive.

                        That senerio has been quite helpfull to fix the 50 machines afterwards. Too bad its never been a warranty issue to Miller or Lincoln.
                        Last edited by cruizer; 02-28-2011, 05:33 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hey guys,
                          A problem I've encountered....I bought a MM252 and out the gate had hard starts, porisoty..etc...Tried adjusting everything then noticed the gas regulator would slowly creep up on th low side until equalized, causing crappy starts. Miller replaced the Smith reg. and several months later the replacement reg. started the same thing. I have yet to find why. Maybe this could be the cause of your problems?
                          Miller TrailBlazer 251NT
                          Miller HF-250-1
                          Miller Maxstar 150slt
                          Miller ft peddles and thumb wheels
                          Miller MM 212
                          Lincoln power mig180c (two of)
                          MM 252
                          Miller Elite Dig
                          Miller Pro-Hobby

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