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  • STRENGTH AND POWER
    started a topic Propane shop heaters

    Propane shop heaters

    I work a lot of nights at my shop and it has been getting rather chilly. I purchased a 30-55,000BTU propane heater which does a good job of knocking the chill down. The 350P does a good job as well. On the propane heater, how much outside ventilation is required so the carbon monoxide doesn't become a hazard. I plan on getting a CO alarm from Wally-world, $20bucks seems like cheap insurance. Shop is 975 sq ft.

    Thanks

    Scott

  • Bodybagger
    replied
    Originally posted by nfinch86 View Post
    Hi;
    Yep, Asked my wife, she said 5.8 cents per Kwh., that's what we pay ! I'll check myself later today .

    ........... Norm
    Ontario gets 52% of its electricity from nuclear power and 21% from hydroelectric power.

    Nuclear power is so cheap to produce, they toyed with the idea of not even bothering with electric meters.

    The following graphic shows US costs, but are typical and well representative.
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • SBray
    replied
    Propane Shop Heaters

    Originally posted by STRENGTH AND POWER View Post
    I work a lot of nights at my shop and it has been getting rather chilly. I purchased a 30-55,000BTU propane heater which does a good job of knocking the chill down. The 350P does a good job as well. On the propane heater, how much outside ventilation is required so the carbon monoxide doesn't become a hazard. I plan on getting a CO alarm from Wally-world, $20bucks seems like cheap insurance. Shop is 975 sq ft.

    Thanks

    Scott
    Scott,

    I remember seeing on This Old House a propane wall heater that fit in between the wall studs of a garage that was not sheet rocked. This unit vented fumes to the outside and had it's own (piped in) source of outside air. There have got to be larger propane heating units that are vented and have their own source of air available for work shops. This would eliminate most of the concerns you spoke of without having to depend on the expense of electricity.

    Steve

    Leave a comment:


  • grumpycricket
    replied
    hey p.t.sideshow,what kind of welding are ya doin in the Clem? I`m a tool & die welder in centerline.

    Leave a comment:


  • nfinch86
    replied
    Originally posted by enlpck View Post
    You sure you pay that little? Down here, the 'cost per KWh' is about 6.5 cents, but the next line i another per KWh 'delivery charge', followed by another per KWh charge (I don't recall what it is), followed by another. Comes out to something like 22 cents per KWh, plus the monthly 'disservice fee', and tax. The ACTUAL cost per KWh is the total bill divided by the KWh used, not the ADVERTISED (in the P-R ads around election time) cost, which is only one line on the bill.

    Do you still come out that low when you divide total bill by KWh used?
    Hi;
    Yep, Asked my wife, she said 5.8 cents per Kwh., that's what we pay ! I'll check myself later today .

    ........... Norm

    Leave a comment:


  • enlpck
    replied
    Originally posted by nfinch86 View Post
    Wow, $.15 & $.23 per Kwh. !
    I'm paying 5.8 cents per Kwh. !
    You guys are paying almost 3 & 4 Times as much down there in the USA.

    ............. Norm
    You sure you pay that little? Down here, the 'cost per KWh' is about 6.5 cents, but the next line i another per KWh 'delivery charge', followed by another per KWh charge (I don't recall what it is), followed by another. Comes out to something like 22 cents per KWh, plus the monthly 'disservice fee', and tax. The ACTUAL cost per KWh is the total bill divided by the KWh used, not the ADVERTISED (in the P-R ads around election time) cost, which is only one line on the bill.

    Do you still come out that low when you divide total bill by KWh used?

    Leave a comment:


  • STRENGTH AND POWER
    replied
    Originally posted by Bodybagger View Post
    Air requirements are going to be similar per BTU for hydrocarbon fueled heaters,

    As previously discussed, you need 1430 cu ft air per gallon of kerosene just to feed combustion.

    At 19,000BTU/lb kerosene (139,000BTU/gal), you need 1430 CFH for 139,000BTU/hr.

    1430CFH=23.8 CFM per 139,000 BTU/h = 1.7 CFM per 10,000BTU/h

    So for your 55,000 BTU/hr heater, it will consume 9.5 CFM of air.

    For a tight building, you get about 0.5 air changes per hour from infiltration alone. You said your shop is 975 sq ft, so if you have 8' ceilings, worst case is you have:

    975*8*.5=3900CFH = 65CFM of infiltration.

    Far more than the required combustion air. I think you're set. But use a CO detector anyway.
    Thanks for chiming in Bodybagger, I figured you'd be the one to drop science. Ceilings are 12'. Building is definitely not tight especially when I crack the door. Still getting the CO monitor as I work alone and odd hours.

    Leave a comment:


  • STRENGTH AND POWER
    replied
    Originally posted by Blondie_486 View Post
    You'll melt your snowboard stuff up in a mad minute welding in them plus you don't want that nylon melting on your skin it leaves a nasty burn. If you want to wear warm weather gear go and get something made of duck twill such as Carhart or Berne coveralls or bibs and jacket. I use the bibs and jacket because they allow me more freedom of movement and don't need help getting in and out of them as I do coveralls. Another thing if you can avoid steel toe work boots as they make your feet colder opt for insulated leather boots with no kevlar on them make sure they have a leather tongue on them. I had the misfortune of having a hot glob hit my foot and it melted through the kevlar and put 2 nasty 3rd degree burns on my foot which took 6 months to heal and I usually heal pretty quickly.
    I will surf fleabay for some carhart stuff. I leave Tuesday for Miami so I can have some stuff waiting for me when I get back.

    Leave a comment:


  • nfinch86
    replied
    Originally posted by bretsk2500 View Post
    Electricity is waaaaaay too expensive here ($0.15USD per kW/h) to even be considering electric heat. We almost always use propane at work for temporary heat, but I think that's because we get **** near the Selkirk rate from our supplier. Using a 20# bottle for anything other than grilling is going to be very, very expensive...
    Wow, $.15 & $.23 per Kwh. !
    I'm paying 5.8 cents per Kwh. !
    You guys are paying almost 3 & 4 Times as much down there in the USA.

    ............. Norm

    Leave a comment:


  • Bodybagger
    replied
    You get 139,000 BTU per gallon of kerosene, which costs about $3 per gallon.

    1kWh is equal to 3412 BTU. So you'd need 40.7kWh of electric to get the same heat in a $3 gallon of kerosene.

    Even in the cheapest electricity markets where it goes for 8 cents per kWh, it costs $3.26 for the same BTU's from electrical heat.

    Now if you live in a place where it's 23 cents per kWh, you're looking at paying $9.36 for same heat you get out of a $3.00 gallon of kerosene.

    Leave a comment:


  • bretsk2500
    replied
    Originally posted by Badd00SS View Post
    Thats not expensive, it's $0.23 here..... I used a propane heater in my shop, 70,000 btu, 30x 75 shop. I used to place it in the middle, and aim it towards the half I stayed on. It helped but unfortunately im still cold. Im in the middle of building a waste oil heater now, since I produce some oil, and my neighbor gives the stuff away by the 55 gallon drum.... (mechanic). So we'll see how that turns out. I have heat in the building, but the design sucks, the burner broke and the underground tank is full of sludge. My neighbor has the same setup and it barely gets to 50 degree's.
    $0.23???? I would live in the dark I think. That's insane...

    Leave a comment:


  • Badd00SS
    replied
    Originally posted by bretsk2500 View Post
    Electricity is waaaaaay too expensive here ($0.15USD per kW/h) to even be considering electric heat. We almost always use propane at work for temporary heat, but I think that's because we get **** near the Selkirk rate from our supplier. Using a 20# bottle for anything other than grilling is going to be very, very expensive...

    Thats not expensive, it's $0.23 here..... I used a propane heater in my shop, 70,000 btu, 30x 75 shop. I used to place it in the middle, and aim it towards the half I stayed on. It helped but unfortunately im still cold. Im in the middle of building a waste oil heater now, since I produce some oil, and my neighbor gives the stuff away by the 55 gallon drum.... (mechanic). So we'll see how that turns out. I have heat in the building, but the design sucks, the burner broke and the underground tank is full of sludge. My neighbor has the same setup and it barely gets to 50 degree's.

    Leave a comment:


  • bretsk2500
    replied
    Originally posted by nfinch86 View Post
    I tried the propane Readdy heater before, Way too expensive !
    It cost $20. to fill a 20lb. tank & it only lasted about 14-15hrs ! per tank.

    Last winter I switched an electric 240v.- 4800 watt shop heater with an adjustable thermostat. It's great 24hr. heat, when I go in the shop in the Morning it's -20C outside & +20C inside !! My shop is also fully insulated as well, walls & celing , then I covered it completly with 5/8th" drywall !

    Warm & Dry !!

    ............ Norm
    Electricity is waaaaaay too expensive here ($0.15USD per kW/h) to even be considering electric heat. We almost always use propane at work for temporary heat, but I think that's because we get **** near the Selkirk rate from our supplier. Using a 20# bottle for anything other than grilling is going to be very, very expensive...

    Leave a comment:


  • Burnt hands
    replied
    I worked in a large shop measuring 50 ft x 100 ft with a 20 ft ceiling.

    Minimal heat so we rigged up a large tarp to section off a 20 ft x 50 ft area where we put the lathe, milling machine and welding equipment.

    Then we got a vented kerosene heater which put out 100,000 btu/hr.

    The unit was vented so the combustion products went out the exhaust stack and the hot air came out the front. We first tried it inside with the vent hose running to a window which had a flapper vent installed.
    It was a little too noisy so we moved it outside and ran the hot air hose inside thru the window.

    Worked great and we didn't notice any smell.

    well worth it

    Found a similar one here.

    http://www.everyspaceheater.com/LB-W...0-LBW1077.html

    LB White Director 80,000 BTUH Output, Kerosene, Vented - Director - 100
    You can download the operating manual from this site.

    There might be a similar type which uses propane.

    Leave a comment:


  • nfinch86
    replied
    240V. - 4800 watt Shop Heater !

    I tried the propane Readdy heater before, Way too expensive !
    It cost $20. to fill a 20lb. tank & it only lasted about 14-15hrs ! per tank.

    Last winter I switched an electric 240v.- 4800 watt shop heater with an adjustable thermostat. It's great 24hr. heat, when I go in the shop in the Morning it's -20C outside & +20C inside !! My shop is also fully insulated as well, walls & celing , then I covered it completly with 5/8th" drywall !

    Warm & Dry !!

    ............ Norm

    Leave a comment:

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