Beginner looking for advice

[wastntim]

Hello All,

I recently decided that I would really like to learn how to weld. The goal is to learn to weld in general and to eventually use my skills to work on potential spec series race car. I started looking at the local community college courses but they are each 16 weeks and they make you take them in a certain order. By their class schedule it looks like I wouldn't be able to even work with a MIG welder until the third course, which would be after 32 weeks!

These are the courses I would need to take.

BASIC ARC/GAS WELDING I
Covers basic understanding of the operation of oxy-acetylene welding and cutting, and shield metal arc welding. Fee is required. (5 contact hours)

WLD-112--(3)
BASIC ARC/GAS WELDING II
Corequisite: Registration or credit in WLD-111. Increase knowledge and gain intermediate skill in the operation of oxy-fuel welding and cutting, and shield metal arc welding. Fee is required. (5 contact hours)

WLD-123--(3)
MIG, TIG, & BRAZING I
Prerequisite: WLD-112. Study soldering; brazing; braze welding; gas metal arc welding of aluminum and carbon steels; gas tungsten arc welding of aluminum, carbon and stainless steels; and flux cored arc welding of carbon steels. Fee is required. (5 contact hours)

I understand that learning to weld will take a lot of time and I understand that it is as much of an art as it is a skill. My question is whether these courses and the amount of time they require are overkill? I understand that it would probably be very instructive but this schedule would last me almost every saturday for four hours for the next year!

Do you really think this is necessary or should I look for alternatives?

I have emailed a couple local companies offering welding services and am waiting for their responses.

Thanks for all answers in advance

Robert

[tanglediver]

Hood Time

Hey Robert,
It may seem like a long wait, but if you expect to weld on race cars, put your time in. I have been schooling now going on five years, at night and on saturdays. You will not regret learning everything they can teach you. Be patient and put into it what you expect to get out. You gotta plant before you harvest.

[Sonora Iron]

There is reasoning behind their madness with the sequence.

[captkipp]

Welcome

Welcome to the forum, young JEDI!

As Sonora put it "there is Madness...."

He's right. The programs have a sequence and structure for a reason. It's a building block approach. You can't go wrong with a firm foundation.

[fjk]

I understand that learning to weld will take a lot of time and I understand that it is as much of an art as it is a skill. My question is whether these courses and the amount of time they require are overkill? I understand that it would probably be very instructive but this schedule would last me almost every saturday for four hours for the next year!

Do you really think this is necessary or should I look for alternatives?

When making things where life and limb are in jeopardy,
I should think that it's better to err on the side of caution.

frank

[davedarragh]

"Welding 101 and Beyond"

To answer your questions:

NO, it is not overkill

YES, it is necessary

NO, do not look for alternatives

You will be learning from a CWI (Certified Welding Insructor), and SAFETY, SAFETY, SAFETY will be taught and stressed, first and foremost.

Oxy/Acet will give you the skills needed to learn GTAW, as well as cutting and brazing.

SMAW, once learned, will open the doors in plate and pipe tests.

You will learn "Electricity In Welding" and theory of operation. Specifically the differences in Constant Current and Constant Voltage machines, and the flow of electrons in A/C TIG.

Once you complete the course, you'll be glad you did, and may even pursue more advanced education, regarding engineering and design.

All too often, someone picks up a "squirt-gun MIG" from a "Big Box" store, or has a FOAF (Friend Of A Friend) who's a professional novice, and does nothing but teach you bad habits, and little else.

Be patient and listen to your Instructor(s).

Good Luck, and keep us posted of your progress.

Dave

[oldtimer]

as stated by dave everything you are taught is for a reason. welding is not just picking up a mig gun and sticking pieces together. In order to weld and weld properly you need to know the theory behind the process being used. You will be taught the proper use of o/a equipment and the safety issues involved with welding and related shop work. There are far too many people who claim they can weld and have no clue whatsoever about how the process works. I used to here all sorts of excuses when I was still working in the field. I have guys say to me "I am a welder but I have never used a cutting torch" or that is a victor torch I have only used a craftsman or I am a welder but I can only mig weld. This is not to say that everyone who is self taught is unable to do a good job with there hobby or sideline. Everyone of us is self taught as you learn some thing new everyday. I am just saying that if you take the courses you find it much easier to understand and to learn to do what you want to do to do it well and to do it safely.I have done a lot of race car stuff and there is no in-between. It has to be good.
good luck; larry

[Mark Lindquist]

Mark Lindquist

To be a good welder takes years of practice and experience. Their are those that get by with mig welding and do ok. It really is important to become a capable stick welder. Its the hardest to learn with tig 2nd. Your looking at 5 years and as many classes as you can possible attend. Even if you get a job you need to attend all possible class. Without exessive pride you should be the best of the best. If you have a family watch the amount of classes you take as being away from home has it's problems.

[ormachine]

I just completed the local comm college offering of TIG/MIG welding course.
Total of 20 Hours. I would have liked 50 or 60 + hours of class. they were given as (4) 5 hour classes on Saturday's.
I am also a beginner. Soon to be less of a beginner as I just picked up a Miller Diversion 165. I will be picking up a Miller 211 MIG within the next couple weeks.
I din't take any arc welding classes, but i will get some exposure thru the mechanical enginnering degree I am chasing thru the same college at nite.
Probably looking at 4-5 years of nite skewl and then be considered edumicated !
P.S. I just restarted school at age 43. This time i am enjoying it
( and trying harder than the first go around )

Ron

[nfinch86]

Never Too Old !!

Ron;

Good for you, All the power to you !!!

............ Norm

[ormachine]

Norm, thanks. just waiting for my electrician to get over to run a 230 line.

Ron

[Blondie_486]

I agree 100% with the course outlines. To become a good TIG welder it is important to learn oxy/acetylene welding first. Becoming a good welder doesn't happen overnight or even in a month or two. It takes years of learning and practice. All of us who weld for a living have put in our dues. I've been at it for 35 years now and still learning every day. Every day brings me a new challenge in my line of work. I work in a custom job shop where anything might come through the door.

Since you want to weld on competition cars it is extremely important to take all of the classes. The classes will not only teach you to weld but the properties of the different metals involved. It is extremely important to know the properties of the metals you're working with especially if you're going to be doing anything with 4130 which is a common alloy in race car chassis and roll cage applications. It is both lightweight and strong but if welded improperly it can be a disaster for the driver in a crash situation.

I strongly recommend you invest the year and take all of the classes!!!! I'm a 35 year veteran of this trade and wish I had the opportunity to take courses like that when I was first learning. I did learn from the school of hard knocks and guidance from welders with years of experience. It's only been in the last 15 years or so that I can feel comfortable with anything that is put in front of me to weld.

[mighty mouse]

Robert,

I had the same idea a year ago at this time. I enrolled in my local comunity college. The evening course was 5 hrs/night 3 nights a week and was supposed to take 2 years to finish. Long story short after putting in a year I am not going back to finish the course. If your school actually instructs and follows a course outline like you listed, that would be great but we just cut metal and welded and got very little to no instruction from the teacher, plus he didnt follow a course. I jumped from stick to mig to tig back to stick and it was frustrating. I bought a syncrowave 200 machine and I can practice at home now, dont need to drive across town to school for that. I understand it takes time under the hood to learn how to weld , but I was disappointed in what our local tech school offered,I was paying for instruction and wasnt getting much. I think there needs to be a happy medium between instruction and hands on training JMO.

[Bob the Welder]

I taught welding for a couple of summers and it can be a frustrating experience if you have students that don't listen or think they know more than you "because my dad, buddy or whoever showed me".

That said, it is NOT a reason to short change students paying for a course and who are willing to learn. mighty mouse, if facts are truly as you say, I would be marching into somebody's office and raising a good stink about the situation which could lead to a high speed come apart until resolved to my satisfaction.

I know there are some poor teachers out there but the good ones far outnumber the bad. You paid good money, you should get good instruction. Period.

Welding classes are still the best and quickest way to learn. I wholeheartedly encourage you to sign up for some.

Bob.

[Sberry]

Robert,

If your school actually instructs and follows a course outline like you listed, that would be great but we just cut metal and welded and got very little to no instruction from the teacher, plus he didnt follow a course. I jumped from stick to mig to tig back to stick and it was frustrating. I bought a syncrowave 200 machine and I can practice at home now, dont need to drive across town to school for that. I understand it takes time under the hood to learn how to weld , but I was disappointed in what our local tech school offered,I was paying for instruction and wasnt getting much. I think there needs to be a happy medium between instruction and hands on training JMO.

Yup, some of those courses are taught by guys used to baby sitting high school kids. I went in to one on business a while back where that seemed to be the object of the day, bout the only thing I heard the guy say was to practice some more, could have shown the kid in 5 mins, I run a little with description and the kids eyes bug right out.