Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Tig welding aluminum setup help

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Tig welding aluminum setup help

    My beads aren't flowing today. Some constructive advice needed.

    The project is using 1/4"x 2/1/2" 6061 and 1/16" th. 1 1/2" channel, which is being fillet welded. Filler is 4043, and both flat and many verticle welds are required.

    Welded a test piece flat, and by the second weld, a clean bead was successful.
    Now, welding the jigged assy. and am experiencing numerous intermittant conditions.
    Arc control, when obtained puddle isn't always visible. When it does puddle, seems i'm backing off to add filler. Or filler will ball.
    Bead width is wider than test, and not as clean.
    Intermittant tungsten contam and soot.
    When tacking, some take 2 secs, and other, well is it friday yet?

    Equip and settings
    Syncrowave 250
    3/32 thor tungs to a point trying to keep bead small so no distorion to visible side.
    9-11 Balance test liked 10
    20 cfm argon
    HF 85 should it be higher? 100 max
    240-260 Amps test welded @ 210

    Funny enough, i've welded all kinds of dissimilar steel with rust, pickling, zinc, aluminized, and a little clean aluminum is workin me!

  • #2
    Originally posted by Bluedog View Post
    My beads aren't flowing today. Some constructive advice needed.

    The project is using 1/4"x 2/1/2" 6061 and 1/16" th. 1 1/2" channel, which is being fillet welded. Filler is 4043, and both flat and many verticle welds are required.

    Welded a test piece flat, and by the second weld, a clean bead was successful.
    Now, welding the jigged assy. and am experiencing numerous intermittant conditions.
    Arc control, when obtained puddle isn't always visible. When it does puddle, seems i'm backing off to add filler. Or filler will ball.
    Bead width is wider than test, and not as clean.
    Intermittant tungsten contam and soot.
    When tacking, some take 2 secs, and other, well is it friday yet?

    Equip and settings
    Syncrowave 250
    3/32 thor tungs to a point trying to keep bead small so no distorion to visible side.
    9-11 Balance test liked 10
    20 cfm argon
    HF 85 should it be higher? 100 max
    240-260 Amps test welded @ 210

    Funny enough, i've welded all kinds of dissimilar steel with rust, pickling, zinc, aluminized, and a little clean aluminum is workin me!
    Most of what you are describing is a contamination problem. I know, you said it was clean. The soot you report is either contamination or you are dipping your tungsten..

    The filler is balling due to being held too close to or too long in the arc zone.

    Griff
    Last edited by griff01; 05-06-2009, 08:11 PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Bluedog View Post
      My beads aren't flowing today. Some constructive advice needed.

      The project is using 1/4"x 2/1/2" 6061 and 1/16" th. 1 1/2" channel, which is being fillet welded. Filler is 4043, and both flat and many verticle welds are required.

      Welded a test piece flat, and by the second weld, a clean bead was successful.
      Now, welding the jigged assy. and am experiencing numerous intermittant conditions.
      Arc control, when obtained puddle isn't always visible. When it does puddle, seems i'm backing off to add filler. Or filler will ball.
      Bead width is wider than test, and not as clean.
      Intermittant tungsten contam and soot.
      When tacking, some take 2 secs, and other, well is it friday yet?

      Equip and settings
      Syncrowave 250
      3/32 thor tungs to a point trying to keep bead small so no distorion to visible side.
      9-11 Balance test liked 10
      20 cfm argon
      HF 85 should it be higher? 100 max
      240-260 Amps test welded @ 210

      Funny enough, i've welded all kinds of dissimilar steel with rust, pickling, zinc, aluminized, and a little clean aluminum is workin me!
      It's actually hard to say what you may have going on here.
      I would ask where the metal came from....like the channel just makes me think it could have some sort of coating like clear. If so it will mess with you pretty bad.
      Pics could help a bunch on a post such as this because we are only guessing without them.

      www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
      Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
      MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
      Miller Dynasty 280 with AC independent expansion card
      Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

      Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
      Miller 30-A Spoolgun
      Miller WC-115-A
      Miller Spectrum 300
      Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
      Miller Digital Elite Titanium 9400

      Comment


      • #4
        The contamination may be from the new jig, oil or something on it thats gassing due to heat on the part youre trying to weld. It could be diverting the sheild gas as well and possibly causing some turbulence possibly.

        mike sr
        mike sr

        Comment


        • #5
          Thoriated tungsten? for aluminum......


          switch to pure or ceriated for aluminum.

          That would be the first thing I tried.
          Last edited by FoxPerformance; 05-07-2009, 11:31 AM.
          Ben Fox
          www.FOXPERFORMANCEENGINES.com

          Miller Dynasty 300 SD
          Millermatic 130
          MillerMatic 252
          Jet Lathe
          Jet Mill
          Rottler SG7 seat and guide machine

          Comment


          • #6
            Some example photos of issue weld

            These photos are the test piece.

            Photo shows same piece with same prep work. Same amount of contam. if any. The soot weld is the opposite side of the same channel. Also, On syncrwave machines, miller recommends thoriated. False info?

            Note: Tungsten is not getting dipped. Thanks all.
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • #7
              get some ceriated. I used to own a synchrowave 350. And that's all I ever used for steel and aluminum.

              I also found that ceriated doesn't contaminate as easy as pure does when accidentally dipped in the aluminum puddle.

              Thoriated is always for steel.
              Ben Fox
              www.FOXPERFORMANCEENGINES.com

              Miller Dynasty 300 SD
              Millermatic 130
              MillerMatic 252
              Jet Lathe
              Jet Mill
              Rottler SG7 seat and guide machine

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Bluedog View Post
                These photos are the test piece.

                Photo shows same piece with same prep work. Same amount of contam. if any. The soot weld is the opposite side of the same channel. Also, On syncrwave machines, miller recommends thoriated. False info?

                Note: Tungsten is not getting dipped. Thanks all.

                It is not even an issue as to whether or not it is contaminated...it is simply how it is occurring.
                Are you purging your line before welding?
                Looks like you either dipped or stuck your rod into the tung to me. Either way you need more practice. Not trying to be insulting just stating the obvious. You may have fried your rod before you dipped it.
                As far as using RED I am sure you read Millers info wrong.
                I'll stare at those pics some more and see if maybe I missed something...I am in sort of a hurry now.

                www.facebook.com/outbackaluminumwelding
                Miller Dynasty 700...OH YEA BABY!!
                MM 350P...PULSE SPRAYIN' MONSTER
                Miller Dynasty 280 with AC independent expansion card
                Miller Dynasty 200 DX "Blue Lightning"

                Miller Bobcat 225 NT (what I began my present Biz with!)
                Miller 30-A Spoolgun
                Miller WC-115-A
                Miller Spectrum 300
                Miller 225 Thunderbolt (my first machine bought new 1980)
                Miller Digital Elite Titanium 9400

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Bluedog View Post
                  These photos are the test piece.

                  Photo shows same piece with same prep work. Same amount of contam. if any. The soot weld is the opposite side of the same channel. Also, On syncrwave machines, miller recommends thoriated. False info?

                  Note: Tungsten is not getting dipped. Thanks all.
                  I have never seen Miller info recommending thoriated for aluminum with transformer (SyncroWave) machines.

                  Use green (pure), ceriated, or my favorite, 2% lanthanated.

                  Griff

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Bluedog View Post
                    My beads aren't flowing today. Some constructive advice needed.

                    The project is using 1/4"x 2/1/2" 6061 and 1/16" th. 1 1/2" channel, which is being fillet welded. Filler is 4043, and both flat and many verticle welds are required.

                    Welded a test piece flat, and by the second weld, a clean bead was successful.
                    Now, welding the jigged assy. and am experiencing numerous intermittant conditions.
                    Arc control, when obtained puddle isn't always visible. When it does puddle, seems i'm backing off to add filler. Or filler will ball.
                    Bead width is wider than test, and not as clean.
                    Intermittant tungsten contam and soot.
                    When tacking, some take 2 secs, and other, well is it friday yet?

                    Equip and settings
                    Syncrowave 250
                    3/32 thor tungs to a point trying to keep bead small so no distorion to visible side.
                    9-11 Balance test liked 10
                    20 cfm argon
                    HF 85 should it be higher? 100 max
                    240-260 Amps test welded @ 210

                    Funny enough, i've welded all kinds of dissimilar steel with rust, pickling, zinc, aluminized, and a little clean aluminum is workin me!
                    You say the tacking isnt taking place in a similar amount of time, may be a poor ground or other connection, I have had this happen to me but cant remember the particulars..

                    It is hard to tell in the picture, maybe the preflow on the gas, a bit of oil on the end of the material, kind of shooting in the dark. Usually when I get soot it means the tungsten has been dipped, however arcing somewhere else may cause this as well as in a bad connection.

                    mike sr
                    mike sr

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I aggree with griff. I have never used 2% on aluminum. It can be used on low heat applications, on thinner material. Are you using pure argon?
                      Miller Dynasty 350
                      Miller 350P

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I am not an expert and will be asking for help soon myself...but doesnt 3/32 seem too small an electrode for 1/4" aluminum? (edit went back and read the second part was only 1/16th sorry)

                        plus everything I have read is to not make a point on the electrode for aluminum...you want a blunt or balled end.

                        also I read a website that had a guy giving several pages of tips for welding..and he said he used 2% thoriated all the time for welding aluminum( which went against what I was taught)...but he acknowleged it wasnt common, but said he gets better welds using it on aluminum.

                        bob
                        Last edited by dvice; 05-08-2009, 10:58 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I have used 3/32 tungsten on material up to 3/4. It requires some pre-heating. I have always used a balled end on the tungsten for aluminum. Miller has a new tungsten out now that can be used with a point on it. Not sure what it's made of but the color code is orange. It can be used on steel and aluminum
                          Miller Dynasty 350
                          Miller 350P

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jerm View Post
                            I have used 3/32 tungsten on material up to 3/4. It requires some pre-heating. I have always used a balled end on the tungsten for aluminum. Miller has a new tungsten out now that can be used with a point on it. Not sure what it's made of but the color code is orange. It can be used on steel and aluminum
                            That would be ceriated. I've never had any luck with thorated on aluminum and refuse to try anymore. I have a good selection of ceriated, Pure, and thorated so I just don't bother.

                            I have never use anything over 3/32" and welded 1/2" plate with it on a lincoln machine. My Sync 200 doesn't like aluminum over 3/16"

                            Is the channel anodized??

                            Try doing everything by the book, eliminate any possible chances of contamination, Sand joints down clean with acetone, use clean rags and stainless brushes, stack all the variables in you favor and check for proper gas flow from you torch. Is your gas lens clogged?? How clean is the cup??
                            Is your gas line leaking?? Is it pure argon?? Or is it a mig bottle?
                            Miller Syncrowave 200 W/Radiator 1A & water cooled torch
                            Millermatic 252 on the wish list
                            Bridgeport Mill W/ 2 axis CNC control
                            South bend lathe 10LX40
                            K.O. Lee surface grinder 6X18
                            Over 20 years as a Machinist Toolmaker
                            A TWO CAR garage full of tools and a fridge full of beer
                            Auto shades are for rookies
                            www.KLStottlemyer.com

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thanx For The Feedback Workn good today.

                              Thank you for all the advice.


                              Extra cleaning of has helped greatly.
                              Cer. tungsten also has helped.
                              However, gassing of the jig material. Great reply post.
                              Part of the jig has some spacers made of MDS. (glued wood particle)
                              After heated, a little smoldering. Done.


                              Rejigging to steel surface and spacers.

                              Thanks again to all for great info.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X