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Inexperienced, Video Welding on street Honda's AWD Differential and subframe

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  • Inexperienced, Video Welding on street Honda's AWD Differential and subframe

    In This video it shows this guy, SP TUNING on YouTube, is cutting and welding on his own Rear Sub frame and Differential mounts for his custom "All wheel Drive" Honda build that is OEM FWD only. He has never had any training doing any welding at all, and no training on welding on street car chassis's and it shows in his welds quality. He has hardly no experience welding and even explains to not look at his ugly welds on video and never showing a good shot of his finished welds. The welds are porous and look very dirty if you pause the video to look at these welds and did not get good penetration and i am very afraid he will injure people and/or children on the street in car malfunction and inevitably car accident, especially since he has shown videos Street Racing and pushing these Honda's parts to the limits and constantly breaking things. If he constantly breaks OEM parts how do you think his inexperienced MIG welding on his street car's rear sub frame and differential mount will keep this intact while driving on the street and highway. I have family in the area he is in and I am especially afraid for them if his rear mounts welds crack and launch parts or wheels or differentials out the back causing accidents and harm.

    When car accidents are EASILY in the top 10 killers for adults and especially children this aggravates and upsets me that he wouldn't get this done by a certified professional welder, when I'm certain he could afford it. He says he was being supervised by a guy, completely unknown guy that doesn't even know whether or not the shielding gas on the tiny Eastwood MIG welder is getting low. Which is probably what also happened as the welds look very dirty and porous(i can see many small holes in the welds) even though he does not give us a good up close shot of them. Even he said himself they were very ugly welds, and I would NEVER trust an UGLY weld especially holding my rear drive train on the cars chassis. This is the exact reason for RIGOROUS inspection for a street car, so things like this aren't allowed on the road to eventually kill our kids and fellow motorists. I mean enough car accidents happen everyday without the irresponsible people that do things like cut on their cars chassis and weld their **** car's most important drive train parts on there chassis with cold dirty welds. How does he even know if those welds are strong enough to withstand the power he will be throwing to the rear, the bumps and vibrations of everyday street driving and how will he get it inspected and passed if it is that heavily modified and welded on by what seems like a complete welding amateur. The only way he will find out is if he drives it and most likely speeds it down public roads and it snaps off from the amount of strain and vibration from a high powered Honda engine sent to the rear drive train that is welded on with dirty welds from a complete inexperienced welder. I can't believe he would try to weld this himself when he knows he can't weld and that he will be risking peoples lives when going down the highway. A professional, certified welder is the only person who should be welding this heavily on a street car's chassis. And he welded on a custom awd system that can turn his tires at thousands of RPM's. I just know this is a disaster waiting to happen, and when it goes he is gonna take out other people on the road with him, only in the pursuit of speed. These seem to be his practice welds and even the guy that was "supervising him" sounds very in confident about these welds and situation. This is insane in my opinion and i seriously need some serious, more professional optinions on this matter. Please go to this video to and at least comment on what you think about this. I have commented very nicely about this and he has responded very sarcastically and very blase about this, and to be honest I am livid with his irresponsibility and uncaring responses. lol is the main thing he has been responding with. "lol" I Take this very seriously and have had many family members hurt unconditionally from motor vehicle accidents.

    I have been following this young guy in Florida working on his Honda's and most of his videos called How-To videos when very many of them show incorrect very "dirty" ways of working on these cars and assembling things, i would know because i used to own and work heavily on the same car he is working on, the Acura Integra, and went to college for MIG, TIG and stick welding and car mechanics and car performance and just happen to own the full Integra manual. Just recently the videos being put out is him starting to cut his street car's chassis and weld on heavy rear drivetrain parts to his honda's chassis that do not belong there as OEM. This isn't legal for a completely inexperienced welder to be doing on a street legal car? Righhht? My family told me i should report this to the police as we are scared for our family in that area. I do not feel this is SAFE for any old person to be welding on his suspension parts, differential mounts, axles, and subframe that is going to be driven on the street and especially since he is a known to street race cars.

    LINK to VIDEO:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JKM...46175537633665

    Thank you for your time, and all your input, I really appreciate it a TON.
    Last edited by ScienceofSpeed; 01-01-2019, 07:06 PM.

  • #2
    Well, I built a whole flatbed for my pickup with the polarity on my MIG welder set backwards. Like this guy I have no welding knowledge, training, or ability and so far it's held up just fine. I didn't watch the video but from what I saw it's just not possible to judge the weld quality. Maybe MIG welding just isn't that complicated...

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    • #3
      I think he should definitely practice a little more before he tries his next welding job. He'd certainly be happier with the end product. Almost a shame to spend that kind of money on parts only to have them butchered with sorry welds.

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      • #4
        These folks are a danger to themselves and others. But then because they're on YouTube they think they are the WFFA on this subject. (WFFA = Worlds Foremost Fricking Authority) There's a huge difference between ignorance and stupidity. Stupidity being terminal and almost impossible to fix. I did a better job of welding the very first time I handled a MIG rig. Too bad nothing will happen to them unless the rear end falls out and bounces through someones front windshield. They're too stupid to understand what the word safety means, let alone liability.

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        • #5
          I'm sorry but I don't see it the same way.
          Not on this project anyways.
          The welding isn't all that great...true. BUT, it is only welded to what is basically sheet metal. Some of his comments would have better been left out.
          If you had to tear it out you might find it was stuck on there a lot better than you think. Looks isn't everything.
          I was expecting a much worse job from the description.
          As far as killing people goes...I highly doubt that. Because it is IRS, that part isn't load bearing. It may crack and come loose and cause a ruckus, but it certainly won't fly out and hit someone's windshield. Worst it will do is lock up and skid, and I doubt that as well, because it will make a lot of noise before then I believe.
          Not everyone is going to go to college and get a welding degree to weld their parts. Not with Eastwood, Harbor Freight and all of China selling welders to everyone cheap.
          This is happening everywhere every day all around us. And it is far from the worst example I've seen. Loads of factory welds on todays cars are every bit that bad looking. Doesn't make it right.... it just is what it is IMO. Just sayin'

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          • #6
            Actually, I bet most people who know how to make a good weld would be surprised at how bad a weld will still hold things together. Not that good welds aren't better, they're just out of reach for some of us (like me). Also because most welds are not pushed anywhere near their limits in practice
            Last edited by Lewis Hein; 01-03-2019, 09:58 AM.

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            • #7
              I agree with FK. Another example....There are tons of trailers running around with way worse hazards. Not saying it's right either. I've never seen something like this fly out from under a car and cause a wreck, but about a month ago I did see a trailer tire come flying off in front of me and caused the car behind me to wreck.

              Your position is valid, but I think your concern is over estimated. That's my take at least.

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              • #8
                But don't you think that these kind of jobs should be left to a certified welder? He could have easily just paid a welder to weld in his rear sub frame and differential mounts.Instead of trying to show off that "he could do it" when he has hardly any experience welding at all; the guy doesn't even own a welder. I mean it's not some truck bed, it's his rear drivetrain, something that takes the weight of the car and the torque from the engine and its being welded in by a complete newbie; he has had hardly any welding experience. I would compare this to a someone starting their welding on a small scale Nuclear reactor. I don't know about some of you but i wouldn't want to be on the same road as him when he is speeding down the highway (he street races these vehicles) and bearing most of the load/weight of his car, In other words his rear differential, axles, and rear wheels and tires and at the same time taking all the vibration of the roadway and the vibration of the engine turning those rear tires. I have family around him and I don't want them being near this street racer who thinks he can cut on his chassis and weld in something that doesn't belong on this car. Look up about inspection, this is illegal to some extent, he can't have this heavy modification inspected without being failed. I told him early on that if he just used it as a drag car and trailer it to events that would be fine, but to race that out on the street is very irresponsible. Who the **** knows when those dirty welds are gonna break from the vibration and torque of the engine. This just IS NOT SAFE for the street. I have 2 years welding education from college, and over 10 years experience welding at home and i wouldn't even feel comfortable welding these heavy modifications on my chassis without having a certified welder doing it. It's about safety, and nothing else. Would you ride in his car with him with these crazy modifications that he welded in himself. I'm telling you he atleast needs to get this inspected by someone professional before he takes it out on the street where he could be endangering peoples lives. By the way car accidents easily make the top 5 list for highest amount of fatalities, why should we chance this at all???

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Grizzly1944 View Post
                  These folks are a danger to themselves and others. But then because they're on YouTube they think they are the WFFA on this subject. (WFFA = Worlds Foremost Fricking Authority) There's a huge difference between ignorance and stupidity. Stupidity being terminal and almost impossible to fix. I did a better job of welding the very first time I handled a MIG rig. Too bad nothing will happen to them unless the rear end falls out and bounces through someones front windshield. They're too stupid to understand what the word safety means, let alone liability.
                  Thankyou for understanding my concern of safety on the road. Lets not forget this guy is a notorious Street Racer, meaning he is most likely going to be speeding with this when he gets this backyard project done, I hope he doesn't. I have had one family member killed in a car accident, and multiple other relatives injured in car accidents and where they needed hospitalization. My worry is that overestimated because people die everyday in car collisions and having this kinda EXTRA RISK DOES NOT justify the MEANS! Again this is in the pursuit of a faster street car, i mean AM i crazy?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ryanjones2150 View Post
                    I agree with FK. Another example....There are tons of trailers running around with way worse hazards. Not saying it's right either. I've never seen something like this fly out from under a car and cause a wreck, but about a month ago I did see a trailer tire come flying off in front of me and caused the car behind me to wreck.

                    Your position is valid, but I think your concern is over estimated. That's my take at least.
                    Thank you for thinking that what i am saying is Valid, it's peoples lives on the road that matter before modifications to make their street car faster. The Risks do not justify the Means! But the problem is, this is something that should not be condoned AT ALL. You say it is not right, yet you sound like you don't see the possibility of failure, EVER. OEM car parts fail all the time, this is something much more complex and under designed than even those original manufacturer equipment. We cannot be nonchalant about this sort of thing. There are to many people dieing on the road as it is, *a person dies in a car accident every 16 minutes.* People want to be safe as possible on the road, and they have the Right TO! To live and survive in this world you have to use the roadways and I for one want to be very safe. I drive a motorcycle currently and i come close enough to dieing as it is without having to worry about haphazardly welded on drivetrain parts welds failing and coming off, taking me out on the road, or taking other motorists out. Only for the means of being able to be the faster street racer. The risks DO NOT justify the means.

                    I think if this is gonna start becoming a trend(younger people welding on parts to their chassis that don't belong), we need to educate and recommend people to get these important modifications done by a professional/certified welder or at least take a course at their community college before doing something this important. I have seen this kinda stuff happening more and more, especially with consumer welders being even cheaper and more convenient to own. And i just think it is something that needs careful consideration. If you don't agree that is fine, but the alarming number of car accidents should have you thinking more critically. We don't need anymore.

                    *Sources: https://www.schmidtkramer.com/faqs/h...nts-occur.html

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                    • #11
                      How does one become certified to weld on a Honda chassis?

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                      • #12
                        ScienceofSpeedā€¦.we get your point. welcome to the forum.
                        But your missing a few things here. The differential on that car isn't load bearing. In other words, it don't have the weight of the car on it.
                        You would be more justified to start demanding that muffler shops become "certified" because the leaking bad welds intoxicate children and pets left in a car with the engine running.
                        We have a lot of "certified" guys here. We also have a lot of guys here that know a LOT about cars and other equipment.
                        You keep referring to your past encounters with this person. I for one tend to raise an eyebrow that your first post on these forums is to get all of us on the bandwagon to crucify someone over something that you ae really not all that educated on yourself. Do you like to build cars and things like that? Because I feel you are both exaggerating and blowing this out of proportion.
                        That's what this forum is about. (welding and motorsports)
                        I looked at the work. it's not pretty. Will it hold? Because of how it is installed, more than likely. It's sheet metal. Welded perfectly it can only do so much.
                        It would certainly pass inspection in my state. I would say he will "test" it more than enough to know if it's gonna hold up. And he will improve his welding skills now as well.
                        I for one am not gonna get all worked up over some guy on Utube modifying his car somewhat poorly and showing us how he did it.
                        Just exactly what would you expect us to do about it anyways? Call the Sherriff in his town and have him charged with illegally modifying his automobile?

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                        • #13
                          Fusion King:

                          Thank you for the welcome. I am sorry if I am being a littIe dramatic, i just do not see this being safe to be around on the road when done by such a amateur welder and still learning. I just want a friendly debate on this, as this is something very new and is not talked about much on the internet. Nor even the legality of it has been discussed and I am curious myself, because i couldn't even pass my inspection with my Honda after I installed and built a custom turbocharger kit on mine. I don't think you quite understand the profoundness of these modifications, he still has to move the lower control arm mounts back some what to make this Honda AWD modification work. I am a big Honda fan, owned many Honda's I've turbocharged and modified myself for over 5 years and have researched these Civic, CRX, and Integra awd modifications quite extensively. This video is just showing him cut the chassis and weld in the differential mount. There will be more welding to the sub frame, control arm mounts, and shock tower, going on to make this work, and I just recommend him to take it to a professional for the rest to keep this from being a disaster on the road and from hurting people and causing accidents, which is exactly where it will fail. He has to cut the shock tower and weld it in again and move the lower control arm mounts before this is going to be working. This is no tiny feat we are talking about here.

                          Not many people have completed this project successfully. It is something that should be left to a somewhat professional welder and professional fabricator. And honestly you didn't even get to see these welds up close in the video, he himself said they were ugly. (Pause the first video i attached at 8:37 or 8:38 and just look at how porous those welds look) Is this not something that someone would be worried about, being a mount to hold the heavy differential on and take the torque of the engine? I mean, in Germany any modification at all done to your car is almost completely illegal, they can only do what the government approves; because they understand the seriousness of these death machines and how quickly they can kill and/or injure severely. People are so nonchalant about driving cars on the road, but did you know that every 16minutes a car collision happens which occurs in a death! It is #10 in the world for leading causes of death. I told him at the beginning there is no problem with this if he is just making this a drag car that will be trailer-ed to and from events and never driven on the street. The Extra risk does not justify the means. If he kills or injures a person just trying to make his car go faster.... just how would that be justifiable? I think you are quite naive to these Honda AWD modifications my friend. This is something that is quite new to the Honda scene and hasn't been done successfully but only on a few Honda's.

                          And yes i have had instances of this SP Tuning guy giving some incorrect procedure in his past "How to" tube videos for certain Honda repairs and I, as well as others, have needed to correct him since people are using them as guidance to fix their own car. Because he calls his videos "How To Videos" people believe this is the complete right way to fix it, yet he's giving them some critical misinformation. I like his youtube channel and only since this recently, when i gave him constructive criticism on this AWD welding video, has he been getting sarcastic towards my comments. I was trying to be nice and help him a bit, I don't like being mean or hurtful but he obviously needs some welding practice and would have been smarter to have done it before doing this difficult of a project.

                          Again I am sorry if I am sounding over worried but the whole build has been welded by this SP guy and he literally just started his welding practice during this very build, so like a few days of experience & practice. There is a time when he should get humble and say this is something left for a professional welder to finish all the welds before testing it on the street. I wouldn't even feel comfortable doing this with all my college and experience. If everybody and anybody can start picking up a cheap welder and start welding on their car's chassis and sub-frame components, without any schooling at all, won't some welders be out of a job? I went to welding school for 2 years and hearing that it doesn't really matter is quite shocking to hear. If automotive welding doesn't really need any amount of experience or schooling then where is the schooling absolutely needed for?

                          I also just seen this recent video of him cutting his driveshaft right in the middle, Mig welding it together, and then grinding all the welds back off... and no balancing done. Couldn't he have just taken it to a driveshaft shop. I would say this doesn't seem very safe either. If this build ever gets out on the road it is gonna be one big can of worms IMO!
                          video of driveshaft welding: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dYFF5MAXOk
                          Last edited by ScienceofSpeed; 01-04-2019, 10:24 PM.

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                          • #14
                            Fast forward to 12:18 to get to the point. This is the kit SP Tuning has and is using, he still has much more to do: Has to cut and move the subframe/lower control arm mounts to get this to work, otherwise the CV axles will not fit and the lower control arms will be floating and not be sandwiched in. As well as cut the shock tower and move it and re weld it back in to the thin sheet metal chassis. This is not something simple we are talking about. He did not even measure his pinion angles for the differential to the hubs before welding in the differential mounts.

                            Not to mention he just made another video of him cutting his driveshafts and him MIG welding these thin wall driveshafts together and then grinding down the MIG welds to look good, i guess. This is sketchy to say the least.

                            And I don't expect you to do anything.... I just wanted to post this because I wanted to see other welders opinions on this. Is that okay?
                             

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                            • #15
                              Thank goodness I'm not in Germany.

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